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10 speed

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531
364
sfo
How is the 10 speed auto doing on TRACK? early claims were faster shifting than Porsche pdk. Any truth?
 
So i bought my car 1 year ago.
2018 pp1 10 speed auto
Put immediately of track after 500miles.
I'm probably the first to track it seriously.
I do 12-15 events a year and I'm actually doing the american muscle cup.


Pros and cons

Pros
1. Shifting is damn fast. I paddle shift on track and it is incredible. Was able to keep behind shelby on the straight because the faster shifting.
2. I grew up with manual and having auto on track shows me the great benefit of
+or- choice behind the steering wheel.
3. Manual vs auto on roadcourse: auto is faster.

Cons
1. It does overheat. Period. Mustang tends to overheat in general. Engine oil especially. Water tends to be ok with the pp1 radiator. (Same of shelby)
Diff with auto doesn't heat too much like with the manual but in some specific tracks you can see a raise of temps
Trans generates way more heat than manual. It does have a OEM cooler(same of the 6r80) but it is not enough in the warmer days. (More then 65f ). I started to have issues after I've installed the oil cooler on the upper grille that was blocking air flow to the trans cooler. One day the temp reached 240f(wich is not bad in a manual) and i started to have hesitation on shifting( lile the clutches were engaged and younrev in neutral for a little time)
From there it became more and more an issue starting to hesitate around 235-230. And eventually last month failed and ford substituted it under warranty.
Now i just installed a new trans
plus I've installed a bigger setrab cooler, positioned in front of the AC condencer.
I'll test it on track sunday with 100f outside.
The 2
Main issues are
1. the trans has a thermostat that opens around 200f. So before that temp no matter how big your cooler is, the fluid wont pass Through.
2. The Pan. Pan is plastic so way less capable to exchange heat. I'm in contact with a company specialized in after market pan to create. A METAL PAN WITH FINS. this will have a huge impact to the final trans temp.

It is a working in progress and if you want we can talk again next week after i did the track event on sunday.
It all depends how strong and hard you push your car.
Zl1 has the 10 speed and people flying on track. But she does have bigger oil cooler.

Hope this help.
Alex

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Last edited:
531
364
sfo
Great info. I suspect that track cars don't need to meet streetcar requirements. So there are probably other places to duct air for the tranny like headlight hole. I'm sure there are more ideal locations.

Keep us posted! I think there is nothing better than a fast shifting auto that acts like a dct or pdk yet is reliable like an automatic.

Dct and pdk breakdown all the time and require special pumps just to flush fluids and have a host of computers and error codes. Automatics you just drain them like we have been doing for 70 years.
 
6,363
8,188
I think this is the trans that Ford and GM collaborated on...not positive... I've been following Alesandro on FB and so far he's the go to guy for trying to figure this out. You might end up running an entirely segregated heat exchanger and fan for this trans.
 

Mad Hatter

Gotta go Faster
5,237
4,227
Santiago, Chile
From what I have seen from a handfull of 10 spd 2018 plus cars at the track... the tranny upshifts really well... great for the straights or 1/4 mile.. But hesitant on down shifts and overheats in less then 3 min of track duty. they are all trying out larger coolers and fans etc. But so far none has made it to past 15min full out (yet). The Zl1 1LE's down here are manual and they really fly (what a horrible name, try saying it fast three times in row).
 
Update.
1st test with bigger cooler went well.
But bigger trans cooler +oil cooler =
With 100f outside overheated the engine with coolant at 230 and head temp reaching 245 [emoji52][emoji52][emoji52]
Oil was an issue too going to the "yellow" every session.
I dont give up. (Yet)
I'll be back on the same track saturday for muscle cup.
Main difference for cooling. ? I've removed the thermostat for thr oil cooler. (I blocked it open)
We will see.

I will subscribe tomsome ZL1 forum. Now the 1LE got the 10 speed too. But
Different pan (deeper amd metal while mine is thin and plastic). And of course different cooling with also a diff gear shifting set up.
I'm tempted.
I confirm upshifting fastest around
Downshifting. Sometime it seems my italian grandmother down shifting.






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531
364
sfo
For auto trans Why can’t a line from trans pan drain go to a 12v gerrotor pump then to big volume trans cooler then back to trans filler port?
 
There is a company that I'm in contact with that is developing a
Deeper pan made in metal with fins for 10r80.
They receive a trasmission few days ago. So another year for it.
A metal pan with fins can drop 15f at least
https://yourcovers.com/transpan_11164.php

Please visit the website and request info( even if you dont have the 10speed)
Maybe some extra requests will speed up the process.

A scoop won't work cause the pan is made in plastic so no heat exchange.

Once again the main issue is the thermostat. It opens too late at 200f. The. It is too latr for thr small OEM trans cooler to do the job in track.





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531
364
sfo
I have never seen the trans pan but I would think you could custom make one or modify a metal or aluminum one that fit another car like maro or f150? I'm dangerous with a saw and welder
 

xr7

TMO Addict?
708
822
Exp. Type
Autocross
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
Minnesota
Drop a large cooler in series with the standard cooler or Bob's idea of adding a separate pump and cooler.
I would think a fabricated aluminum pan would be pretty easy if you have the fabrication tools. The 200 degree thermostat opening isn't a problem if you have the cooler capacity to keep it in check.
 
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I suspect a separate pump and cooler will be the way to go, the reason is that you are forcing the trans pump to supply a larger oil cooler, that would potentially cut line pressure, which can kill the up and downshifts.
 
531
364
sfo
Seems the 10r80 has a screw in dipstick. That port can be used as a return. Then if there is a flat part in the composite pan you can screw in a non weld AN-10 bung fitting to run to a big cooler and gerrotor pump. That would keep all 10r80 function untouched but give cool trans fluid.
 
Drop a large cooler in series with the standard cooler or Bob's idea of adding a separate pump and cooler.
I would think a fabricated aluminum pan would be pretty easy if you have the fabrication tools. The 200 degree thermostat opening isn't a problem if you have the cooler capacity to keep it in check.
There is no need for additional pump. The internal one is enough for the oem cooler and rnoughnforna bigger one.
10r80 has 2 pumps in. 1 for the cooler 1 for returning the fluid btw tourque converter and gears.
The issue with the pan is that this pan contains a lot of stuff. It is not just a cover.
Zl1 1lr has the same 10 speed. But with different. Pan. I might look into it.

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6,363
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It should basically, be the same trans, if the ZL1 works, I don't see any reason that yours can't be made to work. FWIW the Cobra Jet drag cars use a GM Turbo400 trans...basically...when the patent ran out....
 

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