Best source for factory Brembo calipers?

[Duane Black]

Hi there!

I've come to understand that you can put the Brembo caliper to the stock S197 GT brake bracket on a 2011-14 Muscrat. Now that poor me has race wheels that can hold them, why not go for some nice Brembos?

What's the best front caliper I can get then? I have generally liked NAPA, used them when I had to replace other parts gone bad with success. Should I be looking towards anything fancy?

 

[TMSBOSS]

Fancy, no. I would bolt them on and run. Maybe add titanium shims to protect the boots. Steel lines, yes. Pick up a set of high temp seals from OP to swap in if they leak. Tim was running a sale a few weeks back, may still be available. Rebuilders are not know for using the best components.
Then the question will be which pads. That question is almost as much fun as which oil, filter and why. Lol

 

[Coz]

I would get the matte grey with red logo Brembo calipers from a Ford Dealer such as TascaParts or White Bear Nation. They will charge you about $40-50 extra per caliper for a core charge.

Do NOT under ANY circumstances buy any "remanufactured" Brembos from AutoZone, Cardone, etc. They are knock-offs made in China.

Use either Centric Premium Rotors or the StopTech Slotted Rotors. Tire Rack has these along with cryo versions.

In a recent thread regarding rotors, someone mentioned that KNS Brakes offers their own branded version of the DBA rotors at a very good price.

 

[Coz]

Another alternative is to put the PP S550 Brembos on with the 15" 13-14 GT500 rotors.

These are bigger than the 6-pot 13-14 GT500 calipers and the pads are actually cheaper. Apex EC-7 18" wheels will fit just fine.

The Brembos I referred to in my prior post are the S197 4-pot Brembos that came with the Track Pack or Brembo package. The 07-12 GT500 also came with 4-pot Brembos but those are gloss black.

 

[Spencer Terry]

He has a V6, it may behove him to keep the 4 pot for weight reduction as he won't need quite as much braking force with less speed / less weight. The 6 pot with larger rotor are significantly heavier I beleive?

 

[Duane Black]

He has a V6, it may behove him to keep the 4 pot for weight reduction as he won't need quite as much braking force with less speed / less weight. The 6 pot with larger rotor are significantly heavier I beleive?

He also has most of his interior still in the car and weighs 3660 with the driver in the car, 3441 by itself...

 

[OX1]

Another alternative is to put the PP S550 Brembos on with the 15" 13-14 GT500 rotors.

These are bigger than the 6-pot 13-14 GT500 calipers and the pads are actually cheaper. Apex EC-7 18" wheels will fit just fine.

The Brembos I referred to in my prior post are the S197 4-pot Brembos that came with the Track Pack or Brembo package. The 07-12 GT500 also came with 4-pot Brembos but those are gloss black.

Those had a different master, which is not impossible to put in a 197, but not direct bolt in either.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Hi there!

I've come to understand that you can put the Brembo caliper to the stock S197 GT brake bracket on a 2011-14 Muscrat. Now that poor me has race wheels that can hold them, why not go for some nice Brembos?

What's the best front caliper I can get then? I have generally liked NAPA, used them when I had to replace other parts gone bad with success. Should I be looking towards anything fancy?

I went with these. All Ford parts except for the Centric rotors, R10's, backing plates, and hoses. Bolted right up.

My car is running a similar amount of power to the later V6 (but with a bit more torque) from a stockish 4.6L. Full weight, whatever that was.

Where the Coyote guys are hitting high 130's or into the 140's, you'll most likely top out in the mid to upper 120's. But since you'll be able to corner at essentially the same speed assuming comparable tires/wheels/suspension development, you're not having to scrub off as much speed or convert nearly as much kinetic energy into heat.


Norm

 

[Duane Black]

True Norm, I top out around 130 on most any given straight... Roebling, Road Atlanta, Charlotte Roval, VIR.... heck I did hit 145 at Daytona but point taken.

Can anyone explain why buying PowerStop kit KCOE 4507 is a bad idea? Rock Auto lists it at like $245 +$140 in cores. It's not the pretty powdercoat or anything but hey, its the parts. Are the caliper seals bound to leak on me or something?

 

[Norm Peterson]

130 to 70 involves only about 81% of the energy associated with 140 to 70. It's a square of speeds thing.

No basis for opinion on that kit. Sorry.


Norm

 

[Coz]

I could not find the KCOE4507 in RockAuto's catalog. However, I found their other kits such as the KCOE5407.

In any case, DO NOT use these. They are not legitimate Brembos. To Powerstop's credit the do not cite "Brembo" anywhere in the listing - not even under the INFO button. Their calipers DO NOT have any casting numbers over the caliper pistons that actual Brembos have. They are "remanufactured" Chinese knock-offs!!!!

They may be ok for street driving but do you want to risk your life and those of others on the track with calipers of unknown metallurgical and heat treatment quality?

And you don't need new rear calipers. The ones you have will work with the 13.8" GT500 rotors and adapters or new GT500 axle brackets.

 

[Coz]

Those had a different master, which is not impossible to put in a 197, but not direct bolt in either.

You can continue using your S197 master cylinder.

I went with these. All Ford parts except for the Centric rotors, R10's, backing plates, and hoses. Bolted right up.

This kit is fine except you can buy the parts cheaper separately.

Right - $248.73
https://www.tascaparts.com/oem-parts/ford-caliper-br3z2b120b/

Left - $269.37 + $50.00 core charge
https://www.tascaparts.com/oem-parts/ford-caliper-br3z2b121b/

And they only charge a $50 core on the second one.

That's $568.11 for the calipers plus shipping.

The Centric Premium rotors are $63.79 each for a total of $127.58

The Centric Pads are about $27.00.

So, for $722.69 (not including shipping) you get everything in the kit that costs $1135.00.

For the street, I recommend the PowerStop Z26-1001 pads for $60.79. They are also compatible with their PST 1001 Track Day pads. I've run those pads for 2 years (1 set per year) on my 2014 GT and they worked great. They are noisy and dusty. I will be upgrading to GLOCs next year since I'm hitting just over 140mph on the back straight at Pocono and I think they are at their limit.

Go for the G-LOC GS1 pads for the street and the R10s or R12s for the track if your car is dual purpose.

I would recommend Vorshlag's excellent inlet ducts for the 13-14 as well as their 3" ducted backing plates.

KNS has rotors for about $60 a piece.

You can also go with the 14" StopTech slotted rotors for about $120 each. Tire Rack has their Cryo treated versions for about $140-150 a piece.

 

[Spencer Terry]

I hear you on the full weight thing. My car is just under 3500# without driver and makes 409 RWHP. I see 145+ at VIR and RA.... I am not easy on the brakes, either. I run the stock Brembo 4 pots and just run aggressive pads with RBF fluid and I only begin to feel fade after 3-4 hot laps. I would imagine with your car you could push through an entire 20 minute session with the same setup! Additionally, the 4 pot brembos are cheaper consumables. Just my .02, I too have thought about the 6 Pot and come back to weight reduction and cheaper pads / rotors.

 

[Spencer Terry]

I second the Powerstop Trackday Pads... for the money they are punching above their weight for sure. Not as much bite as an xp20 or GLOC r12-16 but they last 70% as long and resist fade well. Regarding centric vs the KNS rotors... I ran both a few different times and I feel like the KNS rotors lasted longer for me, but that may have been due to many factors...

You can continue using your S197 master cylinder.



This kit is fine except you can buy the parts cheaper separately.

Right - $248.73
https://www.tascaparts.com/oem-parts/ford-caliper-br3z2b120b/

Left - $269.37 + $50.00 core charge
https://www.tascaparts.com/oem-parts/ford-caliper-br3z2b121b/

And they only charge a $50 core on the second one.

That's $568.11 for the calipers plus shipping.

The Centric Premium rotors are $63.79 each for a total of $127.58

The Centric Pads are about $27.00.

So, for $722.69 (not including shipping) you get everything in the kit that costs $1135.00.

For the street, I recommend the PowerStop Z26-1001 pads for $60.79. They are also compatible with their PST 1001 Track Day pads. I've run those pads for 2 years (1 set per year) on my 2014 GT and they worked great. They are noisy and dusty. I will be upgrading to GLOCs next year since I'm hitting just over 140mph on the back straight at Pocono and I think they are at their limit.

Go for the G-LOC GS1 pads for the street and the R10s or R12s for the track if your car is dual purpose.

I would recommend Vorshlag's excellent inlet ducts for the 13-14 as well as their 3" ducted backing plates.

KNS has rotors for about $60 a piece.

You can also go with the 14" StopTech slotted rotors for about $120 each. Tire Rack has their Cryo treated versions for about $140-150 a piece.

 

[OX1]

I could not find the KCOE4507 in RockAuto's catalog. However, I found their other kits such as the KCOE5407.

In any case, DO NOT use these. They are not legitimate Brembos. To Powerstop's credit the do not cite "Brembo" anywhere in the listing - not even under the INFO button. Their calipers DO NOT have any casting numbers over the caliper pistons that actual Brembos have. They are "remanufactured" Chinese knock-offs!!!!

They may be ok for street driving but do you want to risk your life and those of others on the track with calipers of unknown metallurgical and heat treatment quality?

And you don't need new rear calipers. The ones you have will work with the 13.8" GT500 rotors and adapters or new GT500 axle brackets.

Be careful of this guy too. He is not selling Brembos (rebuilt or otherwise).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/GT500-COBR...583658?hash=item1cdf6d8faa:g:q~UAAOSwvuhbnuay

See my posts here if interested...

https://www.s197forum.com/threads/brembo-brakes-retrofitted-to-06-gt.136124/

 

[Duane Black]

I was looking at NAPA Altrom too. Definitely no Cardone. On the standard calipers, I've run quite a few NAPA eclipse fronts with the issue being after awhile, they start wearing pads at a weird angle. Replace cheap and keep going. Maybe I'm more lucky than good.

Powerstop claims to do all their work in Chicago. it looks like vs their more expensive product, the only difference appears to be no ceramic coating.

Its KCOE4547, sorry for the typo

 

[Coz]

Duane,

You asked for recommendations and you received several. None of them included NAPA or PowerStop calipers.

The NAPA, whether from Cardone or otherwise ones are definitely Chinese Knock-offs. The pictures on NAPA's site are IDENTICAL to Cardones, AutoZones, etc. Look them up for yourself. For some reason, NAPA's do not include the disclaimer "Product appearance and finish may vary, but form, fit, and function are the same"

The pictures show unfinished parts with the FoMoCo casting visible on the back. At one, time a long time ago, they actually did rebuild the OEM calipers. But no more. They keep the pictures of the FoMoCo parts to lure unsuspecting folks.

Mark my words, if you order ANYTHING other than a Ford or Motorcraft caliper you will receive a Chinese knock-off.

If I am wrong, I'll buy you dinner if we ever meet or I'll send you a gift card.

If I am right, please return them and order legitimate Ford Brembo calipers.

If you do install the Chinese knock-offs, please lets us know so we can give you wide berth at the track. Make sure you let anyone that rides with you know too...

The Knock-offs will not have ANY casting info on them. Below are a couple of the numbers you will see on legitimate FoMoCo Brembos.

 

[OX1]

Chinese knockoffs all seem to have this engraved 4 digit code.
Not sure what it means, but's it's a pretty easy way to identify them.

 

[Duane Black]

Point taken @Coz.

I'm interested to know what it is about Chinese knockoffs that's bad to . I know the caliper seals arent worth a shiznit from a personal experience. Is it metallurgy? Crappy seals? You want EPDM seals I suppose that can handle heat and fluid? And the material of the pistons is different too?

 

[OX1]

Point taken @Coz.

I'm interested to know what it is about Chinese knockoffs that's bad to . I know the caliper seals arent worth a shiznit from a personal experience. Is it metallurgy? Crappy seals? You want EPDM seals I suppose that can handle heat and fluid? And the material of the pistons is different too?

One thing is I doubt they are as stiff a casting. One reason you can get away with using the same size MC for the stock GT 2 piston, and then approx double the piston area of the 4 piston Brembos, is the castings are very stiff and don't flex much (also helps I'm guessing that calipers are not floating with the 4 pistons).

I don't think they are horrible for a street car, I just wouldn't trust them on the track. I've only been on track about 4 times (and never in my mustang yet), but the cars I've driven, the brakes take a huge beating on the track.