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Brake Pads for S550 @ Optima/Time Trials Events

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boardkat

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Lake Oswego, OR
Looking for some advice. Heaviest I expect to be braking is from 165 down to 40-50 on the road course (Portand Intl), and will also be running @ Fontana and LVMS. But I also have to compete in autox and speed stop portions of the Optima events, and can't change pads. With those constraints, can I realistically expect an XP8/AX6 front/rear stagger to work? Keeping in mind that I'm only getting a few hot laps in a session unimpeded (if I'm lucky), and will probably be spending half the time of a 20 minute session warming up/cooling down. If it was just a road course, I'd probably start with XP20/XP12 stagger, but there's no way in hell I'm getting those to work at low speeds..

FWIW, car weighs about 3850 with driver and full tank of gas with stock PP brakes on AP Racing 2pc rotors and 3" vents making 700whp+ on 18x13/335 square Rival S tires (and a whole lot of other suspension/aero stuff).
 

Bill Pemberton

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Ran 12s in front, and 8s in the rear when I was run my ACR, and they heated up quick enough, but gave me the protection coming down from high speeds - never realized one could get to 165 mph at Portland? Granted I did not have your HP , but weighed a lot less, so the ratio was similar. Only ran a few auto crosses with the Viper, but the 12s were decent there also. Hard to completely ascertain, as you are hauling down alot more weight ---350+ more lbs than I was running.
Good luck , as not an apples to apples comparison , and understand your limited runs but 8 in front just sounds a bit low for the application. Did you give the guys at Carbotech a call?

Will drop you a name of an individual ( friend ) who has run numerous of these events with great success and I would suggest you call him - since he runs a Stang. Check your conversations.
 
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boardkat

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Lake Oswego, OR
Thanks for the response, Bill!

I've had a friend's C6Z going 150+ without much effort down the back straight there, and I'm gear limited to 165 before getting stuck on overdrive, so I figure I wouldn't be far off that.

I spoke with Jr. @ CT already and he recommended an "all-around" setup for Optima of an XP10/XP8 stagger. But to me, that sounds like "won't kill me" on the track, and "will frustrate me" for autox/speed stop (I run AX6 square currently and love them). I totally get that an XP8/AX6 stagger sounds like suicide though, which is why I was soliciting feedback - especially with the way that the S550 EBFD works by applying rear brakes first before biasing to the front and hammering on the 6 pots. As with everything else, I guess I'll just have to test and see. Got your PM though - will definitely reach out to him and solicit feedback, thanks for making the connection!
 
I’d also look at Pagid RSL29 pads. They work well with lower temps. I ran them on the street with no issues.

Do you want me to move this thread?
 

boardkat

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Lake Oswego, OR
Thanks, still a lot of research to do, will add them to my list.

... and I think it already got moved, judging by where it's currently showing up for me (GT350 and S550 Technical Forum > Brakes, Wheels and Tires).
 

boardkat

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Lake Oswego, OR
Bouncing this back up, now I've got my car back and time to get it prepped for 2020.

The more research I've done, the more I'm convinced a compromised setup for both autox and time trials will be, well, a compromise! Decided to go with something dedicated for both and landed on:

AutoX:
XP8 Front
AX6 Rear

Time Trials:
XP20 Front
XP10 Rear

I know the autox setup will work; I've been running AX6 square for a few seasons and noticed that the additional weight I've added up front with the s/c setup is causing struggles to brake down from higher speed (70-90) to low speed (30-40) elements, so the XP8 should work well (and I've ran them before on much lighter cars in the past without issue getting heat into them after a run).

Where I'm looking for some feedback is time trials. @steveespo, I know you've been running an XP24/XP12 stagger pretty successfully on your S550 - how do you like it? Wondering how the rear wear compares to the front? I'll be running a standard 6pot OEM Brembo front/1pot OEM rear to start, assuming you have the same? Reason I ask is that I've heard the wear characteristics of the XP12 are much worse than the XP10, but is that only on the front? Also, I have concerns (and so does Jr @ CT) that I'll have enough time to get heat into the 24s up front with the 1-1-1 (outlap/hot lap/cooldown) format that Optima runs
 
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steveespo

Lord knows I'm a Voodoo Child
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Cookeville TN
Bouncing this back up, now I've got my car back and time to get it prepped for 2020.

The more research I've done, the more I'm convinced a compromised setup for both autox and time trials will be, well, a compromise! Decided to go with something dedicated for both and landed on:

AutoX:
XP8 Front
AX6 Rear

Time Trials:
XP20 Front
XP10 Rear

I know the autox setup will work; I've been running AX6 square for a few seasons and noticed that the additional weight I've added up front with the s/c setup is causing struggles to brake down from higher speed (70-90) to low speed (30-40) elements, so the XP8 should work well (and I've ran them before on much lighter cars in the past without issue getting heat into them after a run).

Where I'm looking for some feedback is time trials. @steveespo, I know you've been running an XP24/XP12 stagger pretty successfully on your S550 - how do you like it? Wondering how the rear wear compares to the front? I'll be running a standard 6pot OEM Brembo front/1pot OEM rear to start, assuming you have the same? Reason I ask is that I've heard the wear characteristics of the XP12 are much worse than the XP10, but is that only on the front? Also, I have concerns (and so does Jr @ CT) that I'll have enough time to get heat into the 24s up front with the 1-1-1 (outlap/hot lap/cooldown) format that Optima runs
I wouldn't run CT 24s for 3 lap sessions, they are endurance pads that need a lot of heat to perform their best. Currently I've fallen in love with Pagid RST 3 fronts and RSL 29 rear pads, more initial bite and still very controllable when trail braking. They last long too, but also need heat, just not as much as the CT 24s.
 

Bill Pemberton

0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
8,425
8,354
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Blair, Nebraska
Running G-Loc 18s and I understand the theory behind not using a very aggressive pad ( like the Carbotech 24s ) , but the problem is we all get caught a bit in what works well for us, and it may not work well for others. I use the G-Loc 18s ( essentially a very similar pad to the 24s ) and they work great for me, even in just a few laps. Not completely sure, but believe that is what BlackBoss is using also. I deep six my brakes and for some who are very aggressive a G-Loc 18 may work fine? Yes, the 24s and the 18s are close to twins, so using myself as an example , but the reason to bring this forward is pads can be so tailored to your driving style that working with a company or manufacturer not only will help you find what works for you , but can fine tune to your driving style. My thoughts here are not the answer for the correct pad for each person, as I have been handed my lunch many times by a driver who used literally a very low heat pad , since brakes were only tickled by them. In many, many cases Steve is correct , but keep in mind learning what works best for you is part of the exciting equation of how to go faster.

I would venture to state that Steve's comment is more often the case , but I just answered because we often, reading comments on Forums are not aware of how each driver attacks a course.
 
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