Electric cars... the cons

[Fat Boss]

Even here in CA electricity is a lot cheaper than gas, mile for mile.

 

[302BOB]

That may change when gas need starts being phased out....supply and demand always wins......investors...start your homework..................

 

[Bill Pemberton]

Sure we all have concerns, though one of the reasons I am convinced we will proceed at a pace ensuring quite a few gas powered machines for awhile, is we will have to upgrade infrastructure for Hydrogen, EV, and who knows what else? Supply and demand is something we all have to few in common sense equations and as EV or other sources become more common , the demand for fossil fuels drops and as we have seen , as demand drops so do prices. There are some economists who think with the advent of numerous power sources it may actually help prices stabilize and in a capitalistic society we have in the US , that sounds very reasonable. The politics on both sides often create " Fear " news and emotional thought often overweighs rational. It is interesting to me to see all sides, and I definitely feel petroleum based products will be around for a long time ( and I need them for a Viper and a Mustang in my garage ), but I think it is easy to view that the need will be greatly reduced with the advent of new technologies in the future.

Friend of mine says there will likely be dramatic changes in the Oil Industry in the coming decades , not as a negative but as a positive in new advances there may bring about refining, capture and different usages. He mentioned how few think about it but when Shell/Pennzoil came out with their advanced Synthetic Engine Oil processed from " Natural Gas " few really thought about and he thinks it is a huge advancement ( his thoughts ). No he does not work for Shell, haha.

Let the thoughts and discussion continue .........

 

[302BOB]

Some sort of Energy will always be needed by all of us to sustain our ways of existing...the evolution of what form(s) that takes will be yet to be seen ...Profit margin will always fit into the equation...not Man's ambition to save his environment (planet)...sad to say........................ I've had a solar watch for over 8 yrs that still keeps great tyme.......................My Boss just turned 34K miles...............Who am I to complain about much???

 

[Mad Hatter]

Too true... When you think about it... true "Synthetic" fuels or Efuels can and probably will be carbon neutral in the near future. The once dire predictions of the world running out of hydrocarbons were way overblown and it looks like we will have abundant oil supplies available way, way into the future. That and the data shows that as we get more developed, our children are having less kids. Most of the developed world has static population growth and many are heading into negative territory. All these things point to a interesting and some what different future then we saw in the 70s and 80s.

Have worked in underground mining a lot over the years and the idea of battery powered scoops and trucks was like wild science fiction and now I am just counting the days to see them widely used. Would be delighted to not have internal combustion engines underground!!!

 

[TMSBOSS]

I have had this conversation with a co-worker from Sweden.

Even here in CA electricity is a lot cheaper than gas, mile for mile.

He claimed gas prices were high at home. I had to remind him that fuel costs at home was about the same world wide. The huge difference was taxation or specifically socialism. He agreed to the point and stated that since the increases were gradual and complaining openly about their government illegal, there was not much they could say. Is this our future?? After all, the conversation I had with him was long Before climate change. They taxed the crap out of their people because they could. We are about to do the same.

 

[Bill Pemberton]

The best thing for Mad is Copper prices are up and seem like it is going to continue ---- that translates to more fun parts for the Chile Coche de Carreras !!

 

[xr7]

OK here's your million dollar idea. We need to start a business selling trailers for EV's. All trailers would have a generator built into them. Camping trailer, utility trailer, racing tire trailer. Different size generators depending on if you want to stop and charge for awhile or if you want to charge on the go. Hey Elon, is there some sort of inter-lock that keeps the car from moving if its plugged in? Solar panels for some additional juice. We could make millions, or lose everything. I think I'll go clean the garage.

 

[TMSBOSS]

Or...... We could just lie to the government, tell them we installed systems all over the country, send them the GPS coords as proof and run away with the money. Oooops, been done already.

 

[blacksheep-1]

Well, that didnt go well. 4 hours to extinguish the car...??!!

Two dead after driverless Tesla slammed into tree and burst into flames, police say | Blaze Media

It took four hours for firefighters to extinguish the fire

www.theblaze.com

 

[Mad Hatter]

Boy, I think electric cars are here to stay..... But no way will I let one drive me!! Long way to go on that front.... I would trust a drone flying me before a dumb car driving me.

 

[TMSBOSS]

I would trust a drone flying me before a dumb car driving me.

Sort of reminds me of a conversation I had with my aircrews in Africa. They were western Europeans. They said "Tracy, only one pilot needs to be sober. After all, what is there to bump into at altitude". Yea........ They soon learned of my no alcohol policies when flying for me. At least some did. Others were sent home at their expense and with a $3K fine. I collected that 10 times. Equipped the gym with the proceeds.
GPS and other technologies work well when there is two way comms between sending stations and aircraft. Nothing to bump into. Trying to navigate/drive on the ground requires a driver or sophisticated communications/navigation systems which don't exist yet. We are a LONG way from being truly autonomous. The two guys who trusted their machine.........won't do that again. Others should learn from their mistake.

 

[xr7]

Well, that didnt go well. 4 hours to extinguish the car...??!!

Two dead after driverless Tesla slammed into tree and burst into flames, police say | Blaze Media

It took four hours for firefighters to extinguish the fire

www.theblaze.com

It appears Darwin has found another way to thin the herd. If this is really what happened and I am not doubting it, WHAT the hell were they THINKING? I can't imagine how you discuss going for a ride without someone in the drivers seat. No you guys go, just give me a minute to go buy some addition term life insurance for you.

 

[TorqueAholic]

So my family and I put 45,000 miles on a Ford Focus Electric few years back .

Over 3 years of ownership I netted over $4,500 positive cash just running errands and driving to all the activities associated with having 2 high school kids.

How? I bought a flawless / 2 year old E-Focus with 12,000 miles on a it and paid $10,000. Even with its limited range we drove the thing 15,000 miles per year so a total of 45,000 miles . How much did that cost? about $350 bucks per year in electricity + a new set of tires + $100 bucks for a new regular accessories battery. That’s it. You compare that with a $1,800 -$2,000 a year gas bill + 2 oil changes + Other normal maintenance + tires for that 15,000 miles per year driving on my ICE car I was saving over $1,500 per year with that car.

Full disclosure on the electricity cost: I live near a lake with a hydro electric power generating dam and I pay $0.12/kwh, on the low end of electricity cost in this country.

It ended with it’s unfortunate demise when a kid from the high school abruptly turned into my son’s path at the last second and the insurance company totalled the car (No one hurt) / gave me a check for $9,800 bucks.

The car handled well, was peppy, and overall pleasant to drive. Best of all: it never needed any maintenance beyond the 15 minutes fix / $100 replacement battery and tires. Nothing else, at all. It was a bit weird to never stop at a gas station.

About the handling, it was pretty great for a garden variety hatchback with a few caveats: The battery was where the fuel tank would normally be and intruded in the trunk some. With that much weight in the trunk and a little electric motor up front / no heavy transaxle the weight distribution was about 56% rear / 44% front. At speed it turned-in like a mid-engine car however, traction out of a slow corner as less than ideal, especially with the open diff, the inside front wheel spinning pretty freely.

Bottom line: It was the ultimate grocery getter / errands car. I would definitely own another one.

As per my comment on the Mach-E. I obviously prefer and ICE car and my fear of our ever increasingly socialist government legislating conventional powered new cars out of existence in the next 10 -12 years was part of my motivation for springing on the new GT350.

 

[TMSBOSS]

Once road taxes are transferred from liquid fuels to electricity, costs will catch up.

 

[PatrickStapler]

I was going to say, they’ll get their money one way or the other. It’s all bait and switch politics.

 

[ChrisM]

It's kind of funny...if there wasn't a mess of tax dollars associated with all this it'd be a non-issue. Consumers would decide what works best for them and the tech would follow the money to meet the consumers' needs. Can't have that, so we are left spinning our wheels (heh) worried about what all of this means for the rest of us dinosaurs. Any other situation, I'd say just let it ride, but it just seems so...forced...

 

[carver]

Well, that didnt go well. 4 hours to extinguish the car...??!!

Two dead after driverless Tesla slammed into tree and burst into flames, police say | Blaze Media

It took four hours for firefighters to extinguish the fire

www.theblaze.com

This is one of the main reasons I hesitate to consider an EV. Our Canadian winters are brutal on cars. Sand/ salt , liquid brine and god knows what else they slather on our hyways. It,s only going to be a few winters before the battery's get infiltrated and compromised and then..... the fire starts !! I just don't think they made for winter roads and cold climate in general.

 

[JDee]

So my family and I put 45,000 miles on a Ford Focus Electric few years back .

Over 3 years of ownership I netted over $4,500 positive cash just running errands and driving to all the activities associated with having 2 high school kids.

How? I bought a flawless / 2 year old E-Focus with 12,000 miles on a it and paid $10,000. Even with its limited range we drove the thing 15,000 miles per year so a total of 45,000 miles . How much did that cost? about $350 bucks per year in electricity + a new set of tires + $100 bucks for a new regular accessories battery. That’s it. You compare that with a $1,800 -$2,000 a year gas bill + 2 oil changes + Other normal maintenance + tires for that 15,000 miles per year driving on my ICE car I was saving over $1,500 per year with that car.

Full disclosure on the electricity cost: I live near a lake with a hydro electric power generating dam and I pay $0.12/kwh, on the low end of electricity cost in this country.

It ended with it’s unfortunate demise when a kid from the high school abruptly turned into my son’s path at the last second and the insurance company totalled the car (No one hurt) / gave me a check for $9,800 bucks.

The car handled well, was peppy, and overall pleasant to drive. Best of all: it never needed any maintenance beyond the 15 minutes fix / $100 replacement battery and tires. Nothing else, at all. It was a bit weird to never stop at a gas station.

About the handling, it was pretty great for a garden variety hatchback with a few caveats: The battery was where the fuel tank would normally be and intruded in the trunk some. With that much weight in the trunk and a little electric motor up front / no heavy transaxle the weight distribution was about 56% rear / 44% front. At speed it turned-in like a mid-engine car however, traction out of a slow corner as less than ideal, especially with the open diff, the inside front wheel spinning pretty freely.

Bottom line: It was the ultimate grocery getter / errands car. I would definitely own another one.

As per my comment on the Mach-E. I obviously prefer and ICE car and my fear of our ever increasingly socialist government legislating conventional powered new cars out of existence in the next 10 -12 years was part of my motivation for springing on the new GT350.

I can see them as a great urban/city car, but for people who live out in the boonies where I do, AND who pay double per KWH that you are paying, not so much. And then add in our long cold winters, freeze your azz off in order to maintain range?
Just can't see one in my future any time soon, maybe a hybrid when the costs come down but that's about as far as I go.

 

[blacksheep-1]

It's kind of funny...if there wasn't a mess of tax dollars associated with all this it'd be a non-issue. Consumers would decide what works best for them and the tech would follow the money to meet the consumers' needs. Can't have that, so we are left spinning our wheels (heh) worried about what all of this means for the rest of us dinosaurs. Any other situation, I'd say just let it ride, but it just seems so...forced...

EXACTLY!!