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First track day / Reporting issues

Today was my first track day with my 2012 LS
The car has 1500miles / The clutch + trans are stock (but removed the pedal spring).
Overall the experience was GREAT. I had great FUN ;D
but
I found out about the clutch and the trans issues the hard way after only 30min of driving...
1) Coming out of the last turn into the straight I was not able to shift from 4th (7000 rpm) into 5th...
It took several attempts to get it and sometime I even had to shift into 6th instead (but then you're far out of the powerband).
2) At the end of the straight, I had a hard time getting it to downshift from 5th to 4th...(although I did brake hard to get safely into 4th).

So what is the cure for this?
A new clutch would do? or a clutch + trans?
Then what to choose? A OEM GT500 setup? An aftermarket TREMEC kit?
Thank you for sharing your tried and true solutions!
Why did the LS not come with the GT500 trans? (like the 302S) :eek:
 
And I also experience hood lift at the windshield and suspect it is because I opened the front grille.
I might have to install grilles in the hood or go to a Tiger Hood...
And noted the Magnaflow 3" cat back is not suited for a much lowered track Boss as the rear end hits it against the frame at full compression...
 

dmichaels

Papa Smurf
547
30
CT
patrickshelby said:
And I also experience hood lift at the windshield and suspect it is because I opened the front grille.
I might have to install grilles in the hood or go to a Tiger Hood...
And noted the Magnaflow 3" cat back is not suited for a much lowered track Boss as the rear end hits it against the frame at full compression...

Others I'm sure will chime in about the other issues, but regarding the hood, it seems to be an issue with the GT's as well for 2011/2012 before they added the vents in the 2013/2014's. Pressure builds up in the engine bay it seems and causes buffeting of the hood. I have not had this issue in my 2014 GT track pack with the updated hood, so it seems the hood update fixed the problem. I believe this is why some Boss guys go with the Tiger hood I believe?

Glad you got the car out and enjoyed it overall though!
 
I think you can switch to the Lethal OTA's which can be shortened to stop the bumping. Did you switch to DOT4 brake fluid?
 

pufferfish

Supporting Vendor
1,094
66
Maryland
You were likely having a shifter issue, not a clutch issue. The clutch issue seems to be limited to pedel stuck to the floor syndrome.
 
pufferfish said:
You were likely having a shifter issue, not a clutch issue. The clutch issue seems to be limited to pedel stuck to the floor syndrome.
The pedal sticking to the floor is the helper spring. Replacing the clutch does not fix this problem.

The OEM clutch does not fully disengage at high RPM's which allows you to get the car out of gear but not into the next gear. An aftermarket clutch should solve these issues but I'd try an aftermarket shifter or Barton twin post shifter bracket first.
 
Also, did you rev match on your downshifts? That def helps. Also I would have to agree with Steve in the shifter and probably the cheapest option would be to get the Whiteline trans insert and see if that fixes it. I would think the up shift may not have worked as the trans could torque when going around a corner and so the shifter couldn't find the gear.
 

pufferfish

Supporting Vendor
1,094
66
Maryland
NFSBOSS said:
The pedal sticking to the floor is the helper spring. Replacing the clutch does not fix this problem.

The OEM clutch does not fully disengage at high RPM's which allows you to get the car out of gear but not into the next gear. An aftermarket clutch should solve these issues but I'd try an aftermarket shifter or Barton twin post shifter bracket first.

I have experienced high rpm wot lockout, but I have no indication the clutch has been closing up on me, as I would expect the clutch pedal to push against my foot under such a circumstance. Also, my issues have not changed since the new clutch. My theory is it's the shifter, or rather the remote design. I have limited imperical data to prove this, but will back it up with more sample vehicles in the next few months.
 
Thank you for all your input!
Trans and clutch are stock but I have the Whiteline trans bushing and the Barton bracket on the stock shifter.
My clutch pedal was not stuck to the floor and I have not the OEM clutch pedal spring anymore.
When the car would not shift from 4th to 5th (at 7000rpm) I would then coast with the rpm dropping down / in neutral / and try to get into 5th by revving the engine like you would do on a downshift.....and after few attempts would eventually get into it .....but by the time this happened I would be going almost 30 mph slower. That's how long it would take.
Downshifting from 5th to 4th or from 4th to 3rd caused also some trouble at some point...
I did not force the trans brutally as I did not want to break it (I drive to and from the track).
I have several years of track experience. I am not a pro but I think I can upshift and downshift properly. There is definitely a "hardware" problem here ;)
 
Brandon302 said:
I think you can switch to the Lethal OTA's which can be shortened to stop the bumping. Did you switch to DOT4 brake fluid?
The fit of the Magnaflow tubes is NOT great and there is a clearance issue with them when you have the car real low.
Their mufflers are great though. I should try some other brand, you are right, but need to make sure it won't be more of the same...
I have Motul RF600 + DBA T3 rotors + XP12/10 pads / from KNS brakes / No brake issues.
 
As I understand it, the torque twisting action of the engine vs the chassis might cause the "semi suspended" shifter issues.
Hence the Whiteline insert or the Rehagen bronze link bushings or the Barton bushing...
Why did nobody come up with a bracket to have the shifter fully on the trans and NOT attached to the chassis (at the rear)?
I guess on the BOSS 302s and 302r they have solid or "almost" solid engine mounts that eliminate this problem...
The whiteline bushing and the Barton bushings seems a very poor cure to me if you do not change the engine mounts... at least to poly bushings.
Why hold the trans and leave the engine twist? Not logical to me.
But then, do I want the noise and the vibrations of poly engine mounts?

Questions: Who has engine mounts w poly bushings? With trans poly bushing as well? Or Whiteline insert? Did it solve the shifting problem? What about noise and vibrations?
Questions: Did someone buy the Tremec Magnum S197 kit with the shifter fully enclosed in the transmission? Shifting comments? Ratio comments?
Thank you in advance.
 
After reading much of what has been written on the subject again, I think it is safe to say my 4th to 5th lockup at 7000 rpm is... rpm related :)
So is it:
1) torque twisting related (shifter issue) ??? Change engine mounts...
2) centrifugal problem related (clutch issue) ??? Change clutch...
Or change trans + clutch
Or change car...just kidding.
 

TMSBOSS

Spending my pension on car parts and track fees.
6,205
3,188
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Illinois
patrickshelby said:
After reading much of what has been written on the subject again, I think it is safe to say my 4th to 5th lockup at 7000 rpm is... rpm related :)
So is it:
1) torque twisting related (shifter issue) ??? Change engine mounts...
2) centrifugal problem related (clutch issue) ??? Change clutch...
Or change trans + clutch
Or change car...just kidding.

One other option mentioned in other threads is to add a K member to the trans/engine. This reduces the flex in the engine and trans. Two links run from the k member to the mounting bolts for trans and greatly reduce the twisting motion of the engine and trans.

I have not tried one myself, no need so far.

Good luck with your fix.
 

pufferfish

Supporting Vendor
1,094
66
Maryland
NFSBOSS said:
Which clutch are you using?
i use the spec stage 1. the clutch is sublime. i assure you, its not the issue i WAS having. its all fixed up now. i nail every gear at every rpm 8)
 
TMSBOSS said:
One other option mentioned in other threads is to add a K member to the trans/engine. This reduces the flex in the engine and trans. Two links run from the k member to the mounting bolts for trans and greatly reduce the twisting motion of the engine and trans.

I have not tried one myself, no need so far.

Good luck with your fix.
Yes it's the CHE device. I do not like it.
Have the engine soft mounted and hold it by that device? Strange engineering to me!
Want to reduce "engine-trans" lateral twist movement? Act on the OEM mounting points!
That is more logical and does not stress parts that were not meant to be stressed that way.
Even the Whiteline trans bushing insert is not logical in a way...it should be paired with harder engine mounts.
 

TMSBOSS

Spending my pension on car parts and track fees.
6,205
3,188
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Illinois
patrickshelby said:
Yes it's the CHE device. I do not like it.
Have the engine soft mounted and hold it by that device? Strange engineering to me!
Want to reduce "engine-trans" lateral movement? Act on the OEM mounting points!
That is more logical and does not stress parts that were not meant to be stressed that way.
Even the Whiteline trans bushing insert is not logical in a way...

Agree with all above. Just wanted to throw it out there for discussion.

I had serious lock out issues in 2-3 shift when I bought the Boss. MGW shifter and TSB on the gear oil fixed all except the cold grind on 1-2 shifts. Now I don't shift it cold 1-2 without double clutching. Only needs about 5 minutes running to warm up in the summer.
 
On the street, I do not have a single issue. Even driving in the canyons we have around here.
On the track it is quite another thing.
It is just impossible to upshift at high rpm / downshift at high rpm and that kills the fun this great car is giving me.
I have to find a fix quickly as I am going again in a month.
 

TMSBOSS

Spending my pension on car parts and track fees.
6,205
3,188
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Illinois
patrickshelby said:
On the street, I do not have a single issue. Even driving in the canyons we have around here.
On the track it is quite another thing.
It is just impossible to upshift at high rpm / downshift at high rpm and that kills the fun this great car is giving me.
I have to find a fix quickly as I am going again in a month.

The shifter worked for me. MGW Other's have not been so lucky.

I know what you mean about killing the fun. I took the car to the drag strip, brother had new M-3. When I was able to shift I smoked him by .5-1.1 seconds. Lock out of 3rd and there he goes.

First time out I ran 12s when everything worked as advertised.

I have given up on drags. Love the road courses.
 
HARDCORE ROAD RACERS:
ArizonaBoss
Neema
Cloud9
Yellowjacket
Steveespo
NFSBoss
Yellowboss
Pufferfish
TMSBoss
Further
CaptDistraction
LS110
Roadhouse
Keavdog
Digit
etc...(can't name you all)!

You all track your Boss and could not enjoy it if you would have such shifting issues.
What: Transmission / Clutch / clutch line / slave cylinder / flywheel / shifter / shifter mount / engine mounts / trans mount /
do you have on your car?
 

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