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GT350 oil problems on track?

15
29
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
Under 3 Years
Saint-Petersburg, Russia
Hello!
I have GT350'19, never have any problem with the engine on track, but there is a few aftermarket upgrades for Vodoo, from MMR, for example (billet oil pump gear, dry sump oil pan).

I wonder, how much are they needed?
Thing is, I moved car to the new city and track for the off-season, and there is very long sharp turn on it (Sochi F1 track), which you're driving on 7-7.5k rpm (3rd gear) with constant turning.
I do know some cars can have troubles with such things, so I decide to do research, really hoping to hear from fellow track-focused GT350 owners!
 
3,803
3,745
I'm not sure what these cars came with, but a billet pump upgrade would be a good one, so would an accusump, I'm not sure a dry sump is necessary, and it brings it's own set of issues to maintain. There is usually a specific start up procedure for dry sumps.
 
Hello!
I have GT350'19, never have any problem with the engine on track, but there is a few aftermarket upgrades for Vodoo, from MMR, for example (billet oil pump gear, dry sump oil pan).

I wonder, how much are they needed?
Thing is, I moved car to the new city and track for the off-season, and there is very long sharp turn on it (Sochi F1 track), which you're driving on 7-7.5k rpm (3rd gear) with constant turning.
I do know some cars can have troubles with such things, so I decide to do research, really hoping to hear from fellow track-focused GT350 owners!
Do the gt500 oil pan…..my shelby tech said mine was doing that also so he suggested the 500 kit
 

Bugs

Jim. Avocation: Avoiding Blunt-Force Trauma.
20
28
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Eagle ID
Among other metrics, I record the oil pressure on my '19 GT350 on track. I've driven several ~180⁰ turns including Laguna Seca turns 1/2, Sonoma turn 11 and ORP's turn 8 without a burp or hiccup on the pressure reading.

The GT350 hauls 10 quarts of oil in the pan, purportedly to provide an adequate oil supply. Am I pushing my luck driving this car the way Ford designed it, or are these proposed mods just expensive solutions looking for a problem?
 
3,803
3,745
back in the day, we cut an oil line on debris in the bus stop at Daytona with an S197, the car never lost oil pressure according to the info..it was at the entrance to pit road, so you decide
 
Among other metrics, I record the oil pressure on my '19 GT350 on track. I've driven several ~180⁰ turns including Laguna Seca turns 1/2, Sonoma turn 11 and ORP's turn 8 without a burp or hiccup on the pressure reading.

The GT350 hauls 10 quarts of oil in the pan, purportedly to provide an adequate oil supply. Am I pushing my luck driving this car the way Ford designed it, or are these proposed mods just expensive solutions looking for a problem?

are you saying that fords performances release of the gt500 oil pan for our 350’s labeled as an upgrade is a farce? Obviously they saw a benefit to older 5.2’s and offered it up to us.

to me that is a must upgrade to people that track a lot.
 

Bugs

Jim. Avocation: Avoiding Blunt-Force Trauma.
20
28
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Eagle ID
Hi Blacksheep and Tonymustang302,

In re-reading my post, I realize that, although I was trying to be cute, I may have come across as snarky. That was not my intent. I am familiar with the earliest Mustangs and the Windsor 289, but am on the steep end of the S197 and S550 learning curve. I appreciate the insight of you and others who have been around the block with these newer cars. In spite of it's clumsy form, my question was sincere.

I suppose that, like everyone else, I look at modifications & upgrades with a cost/benefit approach. I am simply asking what the benefit of these modifications are and how likely I am to find them valuable. I think that was “Maxim-7K”s intent as well.

The purpose of the Accusump – as stated in their installation instructions - is:
1) to pre-oil the engine before start-up (I didn’t know that previously); and
2) supply oil to the engine when there is a momentary interruption of the normal oil supply.

I was assuming (I know - a dangerous thing) that since my oil pressure had no indicated pressure fluctuations, that I was not experiencing any oil supply interruption. Is that a false assumption? Do you suppose my factory oil pressure gauge is prone to providing inaccurate or slow indications? Again, no snark - I am genuinely asking. In your opinion, is there a better solution to assessing the oil system health?

Blacksheep, Am I guessing correctly that the S197 you described had an external oil system installed (like a cooler and/or external filter) and that one of those oil lines that was damaged? I ask because my understanding (perhaps incorrect) is that a base S197 V8 engine oil system is fully enclosed in the engine (except for the filter, obviously). I am struggling to envision an oil system configuration where there could be oil starvation to the engine without it affecting the factory oil pressure indication. Would the installation of an Accusump have mitigated the failure scenario you described, or would it simply delay the time to oil exhaustion? In this configuration, would there be another sensor installed to warn of the oil problem that might prompt the driver to shut down before oil exhaustion occurs?

Tonymustang302, As I said, my comment was not intended as a slight of Ford Performance products. I have installed a number of F.P. items on my 2019 and 1965 Mustangs. My comment was an (apparently failed) attempt to ask the question in a light-hearted manner.

Ford Performance’s description of the GT500 Aluminum Oil Pan and Pump Kit says the product is intended to “keep the pickup properly submersed during high G loads from cornering, braking, and acceleration”. If my stock GT350 system does not suffer from oil starvation during these maneuvers, then what is the benefit to me of the upgraded system? I am not challenging you. I am simply asking what benefit I might gain for the cost of buying and installing these parts.

Perhaps I am not flogging my car adequately to reach the G-loads necessary to bring out these requirements. I am using Falken RT660 tires, so maybe I need to use full race tires before I reach performance levels which require these solutions.

Also, Is there a reliability factor to be considered here? I have not heard of a widespread oil system problem (other than consumption, which thankfully I have not experienced). Do you guys feel these upgrades mitigate reliability issues?

I appreciate the time and effort that you and others on this forum spend to share your knowledge and experience. I continue to learn a lot.
 
Lol, it’s ok being snarky, i’m busting your balls…. he asked for an upgrade to the oil system…..i told him what my shelby tech suggested as the first engine mod.

mine was suggested to me after going out on track with him seeing a slight dip in my oil pressure…..
 
3,803
3,745
Nah, you're good, the Person in charge of the Porsche Cup is the leader of snarkism, you're way below that.
"Blacksheep, Am I guessing correctly that the S197 you described had an external oil system installed (like a cooler and/or external filter) and that one of those oil lines that was damaged? I ask because my understanding (perhaps incorrect) is that a base S197 V8 engine oil system is fully enclosed in the engine (except for the filter, obviously). I am struggling to envision an oil system configuration where there could be oil starvation to the engine without it affecting the factory oil pressure indication. Would the installation of an Accusump have mitigated the failure scenario you described, or would it simply delay the time to oil exhaustion? In this configuration, would there be another sensor installed to warn of the oil problem that might prompt the driver to shut down before oil exhaustion occurs?"

Those cars still had wet sumps as I recall, (on the LS Chevies had dry sumps since that was the only way they would last a race), the line to the oil sump was cut on debris, the accusump saved the engine, and a lot of work. It did this because it allowed the oil in the unit to continue to provide lubrication while the driver in the banking at this point realized what was happening and shut the engine down.
 

Bill Pemberton

0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
5,763
4,303
Exp. Type
W2W Racing
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Blair, Nebraska
I did not think you were being " Snarky" at all, just soften the sarcasm, but I have to admit I never saw any issue with my GT 350 using any oil or loss of pressure and the only thing I did was install the Ford Performance dual air/oil separator kit. Lots of updates and additional safety performance parts occur over time, but one of the things seldom discussed is oil change intervals.
I bring this up because after working at Dealerships for years and selling primarily Performance vehicles , one of the simple solutions to what seems to be a problem with some cars is how often the oil is changed. It seems the minute the amount of oil needed for an engine is a ton, the farther apart the oil change intervals become.

I often commented to folks that I would change the oil after two weekends of track time and many would tell me I was nuts, or it was too expensive to change that often. Yet , when we saw problems at the Dealerships with folks using oil ( or so they thought ) the oil changes were 4-5 weekends or more. Plus , amazingly , we heard excuses when asked if they had checked their oil levels the answer was often something like, " I have only driven 2000 miles ."

Ford suggests oil change intervals every 4 hours of track time for the Boss S, and the funny thing is if one checks the number of sessions of 15-20 minutes they run at a track event weekend ( Time Trials, HPDEs ) it can easily be two weekends.

So, not overly technical , just a long term observation that one should check the oil often at the track and a change of oil ( and other fluids ) is likely to be more often than what cost dictates.

Interesting to me was the Engineer friends at Dodge suggested similar oil change intervals for the Viper and that was a whopping 12 quart change.

Just an additional thought and I like the idea of a GT 500 oil pan, since it is quite likely there were even more advantageous changes to the windage tray than done with the GT 350. One model began in 2016 and another in 2021 , logic says advances and observations are no surprise over a 5 year period.
 
3
9
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Bay Area Northern California
Hello!
I have GT350'19, never have any problem with the engine on track, but there is a few aftermarket upgrades for Vodoo, from MMR, for example (billet oil pump gear, dry sump oil pan).

I wonder, how much are they needed?
Thing is, I moved car to the new city and track for the off-season, and there is very long sharp turn on it (Sochi F1 track), which you're driving on 7-7.5k rpm (3rd gear) with constant turning.
I do know some cars can have troubles with such things, so I decide to do research, really hoping to hear from fellow track-focused GT350 owners!
I have tracked my 2018 gt350 over 15 times and only once added 1/2 quart of oil. I regularly check the oil 15 minutes after driving either on the track or on the street.
 

Bill Pemberton

0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
5,763
4,303
Exp. Type
W2W Racing
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Blair, Nebraska
Not applicable means it would not work, whereas not validated would mean they have not checked it or verified it would work. No sarcasm , just a bit of confusion due to the English Language having words that seem quite similar but have a very distinct difference. Hope this is helpful Maxim?
 
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