Initial mods are done. Just need 500 more miles.

[Dean#4AI]

Hey Gary, sounds like you had a great time. I can't wait till I get out on track. ;D

What kind of coolant temps did you get? The reason I ask is that my temps are much higher than I thought they would be and that's not even under track conditions.

Great question Dean. I noticed we must have a 192 stat so my car runs between 188-200 just driving around. One of my biggest gripes with the GT500 was the overheating issue. I ran around 220 all morning. In the afternoon, it got up to 88 degrees ambient (hot for early April!) and temps started to rise. I started hitting mid-230s and eventually over 240 and drew a warning and shut it down. Well I started analyzing my driving and realized I was running way too high RPMs because of the different transmission ratios on the Boss. I typically drove this track in 4th on hte GT500, hitting 5th in the long front straight, and down to 3rd in Turn 15 heading into that straight. I had been running the Boss mostly in 3rd going to 4th in 2nd and 3rd longest straights and 5th in the longest one. That also left me just at the rev limiter in the 4th and 5th longest straights. There wasn't enough time to benefit from upshifting there.

Well, 4th gear is 1:1 in the GT500 and 3rd gear is 1.69 in the Boss, so I was running effectively two gears down from the GT500! With 5th being 1:1 in the Boss, that wouldn't work since it doesn't have the low end torque like the GT500. So, I let it run in the paddock and the temps came down to 192, but the reservoir was still almost at the top, well above the top of the cold fill line. I went back out and ran 4th (going to 5th in the long straight and 3rd in 15), and temps stayed right around 220. The reservoir was back down to the cold fill line right after exiting thre track. Best of all, I dropped my lap time by over 1 full second. ;D There's just a learning curve with a new car.

Hmmm, not liking this at all. I agree that higher RPMs will cause higher water and oil temps, but I would have thought that the Boss cooling would take care of it. Some of the appeal of the Boss engine is the increased power at higher RPMs which is where I would want to drive it at when on track. You need to be able to drive where the power is. I'm sure the Grand Am teams are not short shifting to keep coolant temps down.

It will be interesting to see if others have this problem. ???

 

[cloud9]

Hmmm, not liking this at all. I agree that higher RPMs will cause higher water and oil temps, but I would have thought that the Boss cooling would take care of it. Some of the appeal of the Boss engine is the increased power at higher RPMs which is where I would want to drive it at when on track. You need to be able to drive where the power is. I'm sure the Grand Am teams are not short shifting to keep coolant temps down.

It will be interesting to see if others have this problem. ???

Yep wondered that myself. Hopefully you can get yours out there and let me know how it goes. I wasn't real happy about it that's for sure. I was trying to get away from the heat soak of the GT500 so not wanting to have issues with overheating. This particular track that I drove is the most challenging I've driven and hard on brakes, tires, cooling, everything. I run hotter there than any other tracks though.

I wouldn't say I was short shifting though. I just maintained a higher gear entering turns and got on the throttle harder/sooner building RPMs. I still ran it to 7000-7500 before upshifting in the straights and it stayed cool. There were Vettes running ECT in the 230s and oil temps in the 280s. Also the 5.0 I was with started running hot as well once we were up around 90 degrees ambient.

I'm assuming if TracKey brings up the lower end torque curve it will help as well, by not having to live between 5500 and 7500 RPMs.

 

[Jimmy Pribble]

Hey Jimmy. Glad to be the guinea pig on this one. (NOT! ;D)

Gary, if there is one good thing about having to wait for a Q3 car, it's that I get to sit back and let the lucky early-adopters use that sad/angry face emoticon, while I take notes. ;D

Thanks for the wheel info. I got a little confused, though. Are you saying that if you were to run a "square" setup, you would run the 35mm offset all around? While I appreciate the info on the much needed steamrollers out back, my budget will realistically only allow a square setup with 275's all around. I need to be able to rotate tires as much as I can and not worry about the nth of performance. I always ask myself, "Could (in this case, Parnelli Jones) turn a faster lap?" If the answer is yes (which it always is), then I tell myself I don't need bigger tires, I need to be a better driver.

I also got slightly confused, because it sounded like you were saying the 45mm offset gave you more strut clearance, but I thought the higher offset would bring the wheels towards the strut. Sorry if I misunderstood. Maybe my brain just no worky.

Anyway, not sure if that black finish is in stock, but TireRack is advertising it, so I would assume so.

Thanks again for the info.

Jimmy

 

[cloud9]

Sorry Jimmy I had dyslexia. I fixed my post. Yes you have more strut clearance with the 35 mm offsets. If I were you I would get the 18 x 9.5s with35mm offset and run a 275/35/18 all around. With the 275/35/18 on the front of the car is down to 5" clearance vs 6.5" stock. If you prefer a 40 sidewall then go with 275/40/18s and the front will sit 1/4" higher. Go with the black finish too.

 

[PJWANNABE]

Hmmm, not liking this at all. I agree that higher RPMs will cause higher water and oil temps, but I would have thought that the Boss cooling would take care of it. Some of the appeal of the Boss engine is the increased power at higher RPMs which is where I would want to drive it at when on track. You need to be able to drive where the power is. I'm sure the Grand Am teams are not short shifting to keep coolant temps down.

It will be interesting to see if others have this problem. ???

Yep wondered that myself. Hopefully you can get yours out there and let me know how it goes. I wasn't real happy about it that's for sure. I was trying to get away from the heat soak of the GT500 so not wanting to have issues with overheating. This particular track that I drove is the most challenging I've driven and hard on brakes, tires, cooling, everything. I run hotter there than any other tracks though.

I wouldn't say I was short shifting though. I just maintained a higher gear entering turns and got on the throttle harder/sooner building RPMs. I still ran it to 7000-7500 before upshifting in the straights and it stayed cool. There were Vettes running ECT in the 230s and oil temps in the 280s. Also the 5.0 I was with started running hot as well once we were up around 90 degrees ambient.

I'm assuming if TracKey brings up the lower end torque curve it will help as well, by not having to live between 5500 and 7500 RPMs.

It sounds like a heat extractor hood is in order....

 

[jimprw]

The temperature issue surprises me. I would also have thought that the engineers would have addressed water temp issues throughout the full, usable RPM range and under pretty tough track conditions.

 

[BossJockey]

Hey Jimmy. Glad to be the guinea pig on this one. (NOT! ;D) I already had a set of Enkei PF01s in 18 x 10.5 38mm offset rear and 18 x 9.5 35mm offset fronts. I bought a new set of 18 x 9.5 45mm offset all around. I would have bought the black finish if they were available. Are they available now? They weren't in stock when I ordered the latest set.

I run a 305 on the 10.5s. I run 275s on the 9.5s. You can run a 275 up front on either offset 9.5 wheel. If I were to do it again, I'd probably stick with the 35mm offset as it gives you more strut clearance. As it stands, I still have 1/2" with a 275/40/18 up there on the 45mm offsets, and almost a full inch with the 35s. Since I have -1.7 degrees of camber without c/c plates, and will probably add them, there's tons of room from the fender. The rears will stick out just a bit from the fender out back, but they will not rub. You have a ton of clearance inside with a 305. You could probably run a 315 if you wanted to, but then they'd stick out another 3/16" roughly.

Do both the 9.5 and 10.5 stick out in the rear or just the 10.5 with 38mm offset?

 

[908ssp]

With really wide wheels in the back you run into clearance issues at the sway bar mount on the end of the axle carriers. With 20" wheels you can run 11" wheels and 315s easy with 59mm of offset and they don't stick out at all. There is a solution for the sway bar interference they cut off the mount and relocate it higher up. I think Steeda has a kit for that.

 

[ArizonaBOSS]

The temperature issue surprises me. I would also have thought that the engineers would have addressed water temp issues throughout the full, usable RPM range and under pretty tough track conditions.

He probably wasn't getting enough air through the radiator...you know, driving too SLOW!

 

[VoodooBoss]

For reference when Ford held the media event at LS in February I'd be surprised if the temp got over 70 degrees.

 

[Dean#4AI]

Yep wondered that myself. Hopefully you can get yours out there and let me know how it goes. I wasn't real happy about it that's for sure. I was trying to get away from the heat soak of the GT500 so not wanting to have issues with overheating. This particular track that I drove is the most challenging I've driven and hard on brakes, tires, cooling, everything. I run hotter there than any other tracks though.

I wouldn't say I was short shifting though. I just maintained a higher gear entering turns and got on the throttle harder/sooner building RPMs. I still ran it to 7000-7500 before upshifting in the straights and it stayed cool. There were Vettes running ECT in the 230s and oil temps in the 280s. Also the 5.0 I was with started running hot as well once we were up around 90 degrees ambient.

I'm assuming if TracKey brings up the lower end torque curve it will help as well, by not having to live between 5500 and 7500 RPMs.

Yeah, I've been to MAM and it can be tough on a car. I can remember cording brand new front tires there which turned it into a very expensive day!

OK, I thought you were short shifting but now I understand what you were doing. You mentioned that the temp got up to 240, did a warning light go on or did you just shut it down because you noticed the temp?

When I got mine up to 210 while doing some spirited driving on the street, it made me wonder how it will do on the track. It may have been 80 degrees that day. Maybe I need to get in contact with my friend that is a Mustang engineer at Ford.

 

[cloud9]

Hey Jimmy. Glad to be the guinea pig on this one. (NOT! ;D) I already had a set of Enkei PF01s in 18 x 10.5 38mm offset rear and 18 x 9.5 35mm offset fronts. I bought a new set of 18 x 9.5 45mm offset all around. I would have bought the black finish if they were available. Are they available now? They weren't in stock when I ordered the latest set.

I run a 305 on the 10.5s. I run 275s on the 9.5s. You can run a 275 up front on either offset 9.5 wheel. If I were to do it again, I'd probably stick with the 35mm offset as it gives you more strut clearance. As it stands, I still have 1/2" with a 275/40/18 up there on the 45mm offsets, and almost a full inch with the 35s. Since I have -1.7 degrees of camber without c/c plates, and will probably add them, there's tons of room from the fender. The rears will stick out just a bit from the fender out back, but they will not rub. You have a ton of clearance inside with a 305. You could probably run a 315 if you wanted to, but then they'd stick out another 3/16" roughly.

Do both the 9.5 and 10.5 stick out in the rear or just the 10.5 with 38mm offset?

Just the 10.5. The 9.5s fit just like stock wheels.

 

[cloud9]

Yeah, I've been to MAM and it can be tough on a car. I can remember cording brand new front tires there which turned it into a very expensive day!

Tell me about it. I got one and a half days on the front set of R888s I just finished off! I am either going to get some slicks or go back to Hoosiers the way the R888s held up last time. I didn't do much damage to the NT01s I ran in the morning though, but I don't like how they're so rounded versus the square R888. I don't know what to do about tires........

OK, I thought you were short shifting but now I understand what you were doing. You mentioned that the temp got up to 240, did a warning light go on or did you just shut it down because you noticed the temp?

I wasn't watching it that close because I wasn't expecting it to be an issue. Car started pulling timing and I got the warning lamp. Looked at the gauge and it was 248 I figured I'd be busting out the simple green to clean up the mess and one of the spare caps I brought, but fortunately the PCM shut it down in time.

When I got mine up to 210 while doing some spirited driving on the street, it made me wonder how it will do on the track. It may have been 80 degrees that day. Maybe I need to get in contact with my friend that is a Mustang engineer at Ford.

Please do get in contact with him to see what he has to say. It's already supposed to have an oversized radiator and the front splitter is supposed to channel air to it better I thought.

 

[cloud9]

I did find some big hunks of rubber up in the air filter when I got home. I cleaned them out, but do you think that could have contributed to it?

 

[ArizonaBOSS]

How was the front tire wear without camber plates? Did the outside edges of the tires get chewed up?

 

[VoodooBoss]

Gary, what's your status on using your Watts Link?

 

[cloud9]

How was the front tire wear without camber plates? Did the outside edges of the tires get chewed up?

Actually not bad really. My temps were about 4 degrees higher on the outside edge so pretty even across the face. The middle and inside edge were the same temp. I finished off some used R888s in the afternoon and when I got home I noticed the middle wore a little faster than the edges, so as hot as the ambient got, (went from 65 at noon to 88 in the p.m.) I didn't drop my pressure fast enough as the day wore on. I would bet that -2.0 to -2.5 would be better, but I'm not going to change it up just yet. My next event is a one-day May 7th so will see how it goes before getting c/c plates. I'm sure I'll end up there eventually though.

 

[cloud9]

Gary, what's your status on using your Watts Link?

Not ready to put it on yet........going to wait for more seat time and get others perspective. Too many variables right now just trying to figure out the right tire sizes/combinations.

 

[ArizonaBOSS]

Actually not bad really. My temps were about 4 degrees higher on the outside edge so pretty even across the face. The middle and inside edge were the same temp. I finished off some used R888s in the afternoon and when I got home I noticed the middle wore a little faster than the edges, so as hot as the ambient got, (went from 65 at noon to 88 in the p.m.) I didn't drop my pressure fast enough as the day wore on. I would bet that -2.0 to -2.5 would be better, but I'm not going to change it up just yet. My next event is a one-day May 7th so will see how it goes before getting c/c plates. I'm sure I'll end up there eventually though.

Cool, thanks for the input. I am definitely planning on getting CC plates but I'm trying to hold out for a new version from J&M...Maximum Motorsports' design for the '11+ car is like $350? and Vorshlag's plates are like $430 before you include perches for the stock springs (additional $65! or so)...

 

[cloud9]

Actually not bad really. My temps were about 4 degrees higher on the outside edge so pretty even across the face. The middle and inside edge were the same temp. I finished off some used R888s in the afternoon and when I got home I noticed the middle wore a little faster than the edges, so as hot as the ambient got, (went from 65 at noon to 88 in the p.m.) I didn't drop my pressure fast enough as the day wore on. I would bet that -2.0 to -2.5 would be better, but I'm not going to change it up just yet. My next event is a one-day May 7th so will see how it goes before getting c/c plates. I'm sure I'll end up there eventually though.

Cool, thanks for the input. I am definitely planning on getting CC plates but I'm trying to hold out for a new version from J&M...Maximum Motorsports' design for the '11+ car is like $350? and Vorshlag's plates are like $430 before you include perches for the stock springs (additional $65! or so)...

I got J&M looking at them when I asked if they'd have one available back in January. When I contacted them, they didn't realize the 11+ strut mount design had changed from 05-10. They ordered up an '11 strut mount from Ford. Here's the response I got from them on 1/11/2011:

"We received our factory mount in today. It appears they have made some minor changes so our current plate will not work unless you decide to switch to the 05-10 struts. We are hoping to have the camber/caster plates ready to ship in the next 1-2 Months. They will be adjustable for both Camber and Caster."

Did they give you an indication on price? I had their c/c plates on my GT500 and was very happy with them.