not the usual Ticking coyote thread

[johndouellette]

Your motor is done. You can't just throw bearings in a Coyote and band-aid it like a motor from the 60s. Most likely, you just clearanced something even more with the new bearings. You have an oil starvation issue, a tune that detonated and hammered those bearing to death, or both. Pull the motor, assess what is salvagable, and get started on a replacement.

Maybe? Thankfully, there are no other signs that the motor is tired at the moment. No noticeable oil consumption, no coolant consumption, no misfire codes, no smoke out the exhaust, no loss of power, no damage/wear to crank observed, and no damage/wear to cams. The engine is stock (aside from K&N panel filter), there's no tune on the engine, just using the stock Boss track key. I am pretty anxious to get the oil analysis back from Blackstone.

Aside from this noise when the engine is heat soaked, the motor feels really, really strong. That last race was by far my best event, finishing ~.500sec from 2nd place (out of 62). For a "blown motor" it's really making a few Porsche GT3 & GT4 cars work hard to beat it.

 

[johndouellette]

Thanks, everyone for all the feedback and suggestions. I'll report back after we've made the AC repairs and the Blackstone Lab's results come back.

it's the AC belt!

 

[TMSBOSS]

Good luck.

If the belt fixes the problem, I would consider a refresh into your budget. That was a Bunch of rod wear!!

it’s a whole lot easier/cheaper to refresh a block which had not been subjected to fresh air.

 

[johndouellette]

in agreement on the refresh. I really wanted to go Whipple next year, but that will need to get pushed out another year.

 

[TMSBOSS]

Definitively!!

The engine will need to be a whole lot healthier before you add a blower.

Good luck with your repairs!!

 

[Theviking]

I hate those cars..
The Boss stuff is sufficient for most applications, in IMSA (then grand am) you were only allowed an .020 overbore, Manley rods and Ford Performance valve springs in the engine, later they allowed a stronger set of oil pump gears, but that was all the mods we could do, The LS Chevies, on the other hand were blowing up left and right until they allowed them a dry sump. So I would say the stock oil pump is fine. The fact that they let you change rods and valve springs indicate they were worried about those items, but keep in mind these cars ran a 50 hour, competition life span, which is about 49 hours and 45 minutes longer than the Subaru engines we came from.

Haha. Funny you say that. After a track outing Tuesday my friends and I were just discussing how we don't see Subi's out on the track anymore. The new Civic Type R was hauling ass though.

 

[1MeanZ]

Maybe? Thankfully, there are no other signs that the motor is tired at the moment.

Uh, the signs the motor is tired was the look of those rod bearings....

 

[johndouellette]

Uh, the signs the motor is tired was the look of those rod bearings....

Maybe i've spent too much time in the BMW world. Those look like lightly used S54 or S62 rod bearings.

 

[johndouellette]

Blackstone Lab results came back.

Also replaced the AC compressor & belt, and confirmed that the clutch was stuck engauged.

 

[twistedneck]

I would be very curious to see what the crank surfaces look like. That is a bunch of wear on the bearings.

The crank is so hard like 45HRc i would expect very little wear even in those spots since i don't see any evidence of overheating and thats what would soften the crank surface enough to wear.. I wonder what could have caused that local bearing wear though.. hmm. Do all BOSS 302's have this pattern?

 

[twistedneck]

Your motor is done. You can't just throw bearings in a Coyote and band-aid it like a motor from the 60s. Most likely, you just clearanced something even more with the new bearings. You have an oil starvation issue, a tune that detonated and hammered those bearing to death, or both. Pull the motor, assess what is salvagable, and get started on a replacement.

Maybe he would see a shiznit ton of Knock in the logs.. especially with that horrible gas. Great point on hammering it but why only one cylinder?

 

[wheelmanrob]

It gets the horrible Cali 91 octane. I add a bottle of VP or Boostane for autox events.

I'd like to switch to E-85, but we don't have any gas stations in Santa Barbara that carry it. The nearest stations are at least a 45-minute drive away.

Do you have the Trackey activated, if so how often do you use it? Your bearing photo looks a lot like knock damage to the connecting rod bearings.

I'm starting to read more about Boss 302's that have the Trackey activated having hurt connecting rod bearings and rod knock. Apparently, the Trackey tune is on the lean side with knock detection lessened. That coupled with these Gen 1 coyote/roadrunner engines having the rear cylinder cooling deficiency can be a bad combination. But your bearing wear looked like it was not only on the rear cylinders assuming they were placed in the photo how they came out of the engine.

Are others here starting to see this trend as well? On the lower mileage Boss 302's there are even issues cropping up with worn rod bearings.

Ford stated premium fuel must be used with the Trackey, in California thats only 91 (and other states have 93). Your fuel additive should have been fine, but maybe it wasnt engouh? From what I'm reading on this site is that you need to be using race gas when using the Trackey as engine damage can occur.

 

[johndouellette]

Do you have the Trackey activated, if so how often do you use it? Your bearing photo looks a lot like knock damage to the connecting rod bearings.

I'm starting to read more about Boss 302's that have the Trackey activated having hurt connecting rod bearings and rod knock. Apparently, the Trackey tune is on the lean side with knock detection lessened. That coupled with these Gen 1 coyote/roadrunner engines having the rear cylinder cooling deficiency can be a bad combination. But your bearing wear looked like it was not only on the rear cylinders assuming they were placed in the photo how they came out of the engine.

Are others here starting to see this trend as well? On the lower mileage Boss 302's there are even issues cropping up with worn rod bearings.

Ford stated premium fuel must be used with the Trackey, in California thats only 91 (and other states have 93). Your fuel additive should have been fine, but maybe it wasnt engouh? From what I'm reading on this site is that you need to be using race gas when using the Trackey as engine damage can occur.

I've heard that too, and have had the same concern too. I only have the TrackKey and have never driven the car with the regular key. I'll add getting a regular key to the top of my to-do list!

 

[johndouellette]

Tracked the weird tick/clank noise down the secondary timing chain area. Replaced everything in primary & secondary (added a few MMR goodies) and now the engine sounds normal again.

 

[ArizonaBOSS]

I know how much fun that is to do in-car...weeeee

 

[wheelmanrob]

I've heard that too, and have had the same concern too. I only have the TrackKey and have never driven the car with the regular key. I'll add getting a regular key to the top of my to-do list!

I'd be willing to bet that's what damaged your original rod bearings. Did the main bearings look fine? Did the bearing material from your original rod bearings damage anything else in your engine (cam journals etc.)?

I would get it retuned using HP Tuners to allow you to have both silver and red keys (with their own tune each, you could even have the red key tuned properly for 91). Getting a regular sliver key would allow you to use the non-trackey tune which would probably help, but having the Trackey and its features is a big part of owing a Boss IMO.

 

[Apexpny]

Wow, that bearing wear is insane! As painful as it will be, I highly suggest pulling that engine and have it gone through. However, it won't be cheap, probably at least 10k or more for a good rebuild. That engine will have a rod through the side of the block at some point in the near future or some other catastrophic failure, especially if you continue tracking it. Good luck man!

 

[johndouellette]

I'm a little surprised by how alarmed people are about the bearing where. I expected to see a lot of wear given the 79K of city/autox miles. Is it that uncommon in coyotes with less than 100K miles?

 

[steveespo]

That oil report and those pictures show wiped bearings. Starved for oil at some point. Good luck with it.

 

[johndouellette]

That oil report and those pictures show wiped bearings. Starved for oil at some point. Good luck with it.

I had the oil pan & oil pump from the new GT500 installed while the rod bearings were replaced. Would the improvement in oil pan baffling and flow rate on the pump be enough to prevent oil starvation?