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pinion angle and wheel hop/CHE x member kit install

. i know this has been brought up before,---have steeda Boss springs, lowered the rear,around 3/4".have the bottom of the spring pigtail end parallel to the axle shaft. BMR rear upper and lower control arms. QA-1 panhard,w/Steeda brace.a 1 piece aluminum Axle Exchange driveshaft.whiteline rear re-location brackets(not yet added)whiteline trans insert.problem is wheelhop. initially,had the upper BMR mount in the upper hole. moved it to the lower.have checked pinion.here is where i'm second guessing myself. i don't know the factory pinion angle with the 2 piece shaft,but i am chasing the angle. on the diff-the bottom lower flat,behind the flange is ,give or take a 1/2 degree, is 0. the driveshaft is 4.5.from my drag racing days,thats close. i can't shorten the upper arm any more,to bring down that angle.its at it's shortest now. shocks are set at 3. i swapped over the stock Parellies to 18" nitto 555s,which have more sidewall. still getting hop.but not near as bad.at hiway speed,no vibes,a bit of rear gear whine,when i let off,coast,which is another thing.i know i can set the shocks firmer,but feel it should be cured by now. ideally,i'd like 2-3 degrees.what are ya'll running with the 1 piece shaft?
 

Senderofan

Having more fun than should be allowed..in my Boss
Re: pinion angle and wheel hop

boss742 said:
. i know this has been brought up before,---have steeda Boss springs, lowered the rear,around 3/4".have the bottom of the spring pigtail end parallel to the axle shaft. BMR rear upper and lower control arms. QA-1 panhard,w/Steeda brace.a 1 piece aluminum Axle Exchange driveshaft.whiteline rear re-location brackets(not yet added)whiteline trans insert.problem is wheelhop. initially,had the upper BMR mount in the upper hole. moved it to the lower.have checked pinion.here is where i'm second guessing myself. i don't know the factory pinion angle with the 2 piece shaft,but i am chasing the angle. on the diff-the lower flat,behind the flange is ,give or take a 1/2 degree, is 0. the driveshaft is 4.5.from my drag racing days,thats close. i can't shorten the upper arm any more,to bring down that angle.its at it's shortest now. shocks are set at 3. i swapped over the stock Parellies to 18" nitto 555s,which have more sidewall. still getting hop.but not near as bad.at hiway speed,no vibes,a bit of rear gear whine,when i let off,coast,which is another thing.i know i can set the shocks firmer,but feel it should be cured by now. ideally,i'd like 2-3 degrees.what are ya'll running with the 1 piece shaft?

So being you lowered the vehicle....you need to install the lower control arm relocation brackets and lower the axle end of those arms. Your LCA's are probably level with the ground or higher at the axle end than the chassis....this is going to add to wheel hop. I'm not familiar with your UCA arm or bracket. I just completed installing a Steeda UCA Bracket and adjustable control arm......had the factory bracket and an adjustable Hotchkis upper control arm with Heim joint, previous to the Steeda, which caused a lot of noise. In any event...Steeda says -2.0 to -5.0 degrees with a two piece drive shaft. I set mine at -2.1 degrees. I've got to believe you'd want -1.0 to -2.0 to help with upward twisting of the axle with hard acceleration. If your UCA mounting bracket has multiple mounting holes for the arm....you'll have to experiment a little. My vehicle is lowered more in the rear than yours.....I'm using the lower OEM length mounting hole on my Steeda bracket. This lowers the arm by @ 1/2" at the chassis and my arm is almost parallel with the ground with the suspension loaded. I've got plenty of adjustment range....and I've got zero issues with squatting or raising of the rear on hard acceleration.

Good luck....I've found it hard to find concrete answers to some of the suspension parameters.....some call it the Black Art of motor sports...some say that it's a bit of Voo Doo involved. Guess it's a complex science that is mostly practiced by race teams. We lowly enthusiasts are left to our own devices for the most part ;D


Wayne
 

Senderofan

Having more fun than should be allowed..in my Boss
Re: pinion angle and wheel hop

Also...Don't base your pinion angle measurement off of the diff. case. You need to take one reading from the pinion joint at the Diff. and a reading off of the drive shaft.

Here's a link to the pdf. that Steeda uses for setting up pinion angle with their products. Page two demonstrates where to take your measurements:

http://www.steeda.com/store/uploads/555-4112-1.pdf

The pdf. also explains the proper procedure to figure out your pinion angle with a one piece drive shaft. So apparently, they want you to end up with -2.0 to -5.0 degrees like I did. so...if you truly are at zero...you need to adjust yours....to save wear and tear on the pinion joint.

Wayne
 
Re: pinion angle and wheel hop

Thanks Wayne.i also measured on the new pinion collar flange that came with the driveshaft kit.it was the same.i was thinking that the little the car was lowered, Id base on that being closer to stock ride.hoping after the re location brackets are on, that it will give a 1 or 2 more degrees..I was also thinking that it is the combined angles of both the driveshaft, and the diff, subtracting the differance.0 at diff,4.5 driveshaft=4.5..if after the re location brackets, it changes to 2 degrees on the other side(+)-example, that w.ould be 3.? Am I on track with that?. I'll look up that Steeda info later tonight.
 

Senderofan

Having more fun than should be allowed..in my Boss
Re: pinion angle and wheel hop

boss742 said:
Thanks Wayne.i also measured on the new pinion collar flange that came with the driveshaft kit.it was the same.i was thinking that the little the car was lowered, Id base on that being closer to stock ride.hoping after the re location brackets are on, that it will give a 1 or 2 more degrees..I was also thinking that it is the combined angles of both the driveshaft, and the diff, subtracting the differance.0 at diff,4.5 driveshaft=4.5..if after the re location brackets, it changes to 2 degrees on the other side(+)-example, that w.ould be 3.? Am I on track with that?. I'll look up that Steeda info later tonight.

Definitely read up on how to do the measurements.....I think the pdf. from Steeda does a nice, concise, job that will help you. You have multiple variables that you've changed on your suspensions geometry...along with the one piece drive shaft. You'll really want to make sure those lower control arms are sloped in the correct direction. You really need to get your pinion angle figured out and set correctly...which might mean moving to a different mounting hole in the Upper control arm mounting bracket. I'm far from having any expertise in setting up suspensions....but I traveled the path you are currently on. I think your situation is more complicated than mine.....I went with Hotchkis for most of my components others have stuck with FRPP....except for my Koni Yellows and BMR lowering brackets. . I think mixing different manufacturers together can complicate a set up. Guess I'd recommend reading up....start by making sure your LCA relocation brackets are installed and set properly. Then tackle the UCA. Guess I would not drive the vehicle until you get things sorted out....you'd hate to booger up something with the pinion. Guess if all else fails....find a competent shop to get things sorted out........for me....that isn't an option.

Good Luck....Take your time with measuring and making adjustments. Hopefully some of the Experts here will chime in and give you better advice than I can.

Wayne
 
Re: pinion angle and wheel hop/fog pods/che kit

[imgINSTALLED THE wHITELINE R.C.A. RELOCATION BRACKETS,AND RAISED THE PINION ANGLE,GETTING 2 *S. NOW AT BURLY LAUNCHES,CAR DRIFTS,BOILING THE REAR TIRES.AT LESSER RPMS 1ST GEAR STARTS--CAN HEAR THE TIRES BRIEFLY SKIP,WHILE SQUEEZING THROTTLE.ALL GOOD,AND WILL PLAY WITH SHOCK SETTINGS. ALSO GOT 4TH GEAR CHIRPS.NOW ONTO THE CHE X MEMBER BRACE W/ROD END TORQUE RODS-KIT,THINGY.AND STEEDA STRUT MOUNT KITS.ONE THING I DID NOTICE WAS AFTER PARKING THE CAR IN MY SMALLER GARAGE.COMING BACK INTO THE GARAGE AFTER 2-3 HOURS,I NOTICED THE HEAT.NOT REALLY ON HOT DAYS SO FAR,MAYBE 75 ISH.I'VE READ OTHER POSTS ABOUT THE GRILL AREA,AND THE COOLING DEAL. PROBABLY NOT THE THREAD TO MENTION IT,,.I REMOVED THE GRILL AND CUT OUT THE FUGAzI FOG PODS,I DIDN'T CARE FOR THE WIRE MESH LOOK. I HAD OLD PIONEER 6X9 REAR DECK SPEAKER GRILLS. I CUT TO FIT OVERSIZE,FOLDED THEM OVER THE CUTOUT SIZE, AND PL'D(CONTRACTOR ADHEASIVE) THEM IN-AFTER PREPPING THE PLASTIC. I'LL GET MY DAUGHTER TO UPLOAD PICS- I'M COMPUTER DENSE. THEY LOOK GOOD,AND THINK IT RAN A HAIR COOLER. HOTTER DAYS WILL TELL.
 
as i mentioned, the CHE kit to be installed. did that today.well made,however, rod ends - threaded ends could be bigger diameter. it is tight confines. first impression.-lots of NV.i did already have the Whiteline trans mount bushing in. i did not like some others report,more noise. after this kit,however i do now.chassis seems slightly tighter,have not really had the chance to flog it in the corners.not sure if i'll keep the rod ends in place.Update.!!!! put some miles on the car ,a good hour,cruising past the BATES MOTEL set tonight.definitley shifts- into gear even better now. the whiteline trans bush was an improvement. the CHE brace is the cherry on top.initial turn in is more precise and quicker,when entering apex.its a little noisier now. i will disconnect the sound tube see if that helps some.i nailed it ,in first gear, with 2 people in the car,experienced no wheel hop.whatsoever.car feels more rigid.i highly recommend the Whiteline trans insert,and the CHE kit.(had mine powder coated orange,slightly extra)and together ,less than $220.!
 

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