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Real world experience: Michelin PSS vs BFG Sport Comp 2

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Anyone tried either tire with some feedback?
I've heard a lot of 2nd hand feedback from parties who do not drive the same car and don't necessarily track their car like I do.
Perhaps the more enthusiast crowd here can help out.

Those of you who've been to Miller: How did the Comp 2's fare? How did they perform under repeated lapping and increased tire temps? How would you compare these against the stock P zeros (I don't like them very much!)?

I know for a fact that PSS are fantastic rubber. However, I'm up in Canada and the cost difference between PSS and Comp 2 is a significant $125 per tire. We're talking $1200 vs $1700 for rubber here... I guess the million dollar question is: Is the PSS that much better than Comp 2?

Would love to hear some first hand feedback on experiences with either tire... it'll help me greatly. I know there have been a plethora of tire threads, but none of them really speak to either of these tires with a direct comparison in mind. If in the end, either tire choice is an upgrade over the pzeros, then I'm happy. I can figure out what I want to do... It's just hard to swallow a $500 cost difference when that $500 can be spent on other items like brake pads, or a bucket seat, you know? :D
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
boro92 said:
How would you compare these against the stock P zeros (I don't like them very much!)?

I did not try them in the same sizes (on the GT) as the stock Brembo 255 P Zeros, but my feeling is that the Comp 2s are similar in traction and the PSS are a bit more.

I guess the million dollar question is: Is the PSS that much better than Comp 2?

For the street, no. On the track, maybe.

I didn't use the SC2 for long or at the track, but I plan to put them back on the GT for street use soon.

Only ran the PSS for a couple of track days and a little street time last winter. They like a lot of pressure and camber. I've been keeping the set for use as rain/cold track tires. The 295s in the rear grip and held up great. I think the 265 fronts were being a little over driven and may not be big enough for our heavy nose. The fronts were on a 9" rim and I'd like to try them again on a 10" or 9.5", if I have a chance to do so.

Good luck deciding!
 
I have the PSS in the same sizes as Grant and they are superior in every way compared to the stock Pirellis. I don't drive my car in the rain but the PSS are known to be one if not the street performance tire in the wet which I suspect will be a consideration for where you live.
 

steveespo

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I love the PSS. Used them for 7 track days and about 3200 road miles. They are heat cycled out for track use at this point. But for 6.5 days they were excellent on track. Tread wear is excellent so they are fine for street use still, just won't make lap time anymore.
Steve
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
No comments on the SC2 at Track Attack? We didn't have them on the Bosses, but did get them on day 2 with the FR500S when our slicks were swapped out due to rain. Forgot to mention that they worked well there, but I'm not very aggressive on a wet track.

We ran on the PS2 with the Bosses, and they were great...way better than the P Zeros.
 

pufferfish

Supporting Vendor
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Not that this thread is about these tires, but I found that the toyo t1 are reeeaaally good. I think they are 90% the performance of the pss. They last longer and cost a bunch less(in the states). You may want to see if those are available in canada for a reasonable price.
 
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Grant 302 said:
No comments on the SC2 at Track Attack? We didn't have them on the Bosses, but did get them on day 2 with the FR500S when our slicks were swapped out due to rain. Forgot to mention that they worked well there, but I'm not very aggressive on a wet track.

We ran on the PS2 with the Bosses, and they were great...way better than the P Zeros.

Yeah :( Would love to hear feedback on the SC2 from Track Attack. Thanks for your notes. Good to know that they work well in the wet (as advertised :D). Because the P zero's sure don't!
 
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Going to add some comments that I just dug up about the SC2 from various sources:

vorshlag said:
"Really liked all 3 tires. Sport COMP-2 made 1.05g, Rival made 1.15, and the R1-S made 1.19. All very similar in feel, lots of usable slip angle, great steering response." So I was the first volunteer in our group to drive in the skidpad and we began with the Sport COMP-2. This tire felt pretty nice and made a respectable 1.05g lateral through the skidpad, as displayed on a large display and read to me by a right-seat instructor. Very predictable, lots of audible feedback, and decent feel given the grip levels. There was a fairly large ridge down the middle of the lot and the middle of the skidpad, so it made for an unusual loss of grip at two points along the circle. This highlighted the ease of control of each tires, purely on accident.

mustangsource said:
I have these on my boss now
...... Love them sides wear alittle harder during autcross

miata.net said:
I had mentioned these are very solid dry and wet performing tires but mentioned they are not ideal for the track. I need to take back that statement. While there are still better track day tires like the BFG Rival I recently got back from Miller Motorsports High performance driving school. We ran hard for 2 days on the track with lots of track time. They use track preparred Ford Mustangs with the BFG Gforce Comp2 tire. Handling was very good and the tires held up very well on the track. So these can certainly work for a budget track day car. I love this tire for a daily driver with occasional Auto X or Track day.

bossforum said:
know I'm a bit late to this post but felt it worth the time to login and reply. At the Boss Track Attack in SLC, Utah's Miller Motorsports Park the BFG's were great for what they are intended to be aka not slicks. Now what you should really be asking is how do they stack up to the Pirelli P Zero's that come stock on our Bosses. Well they put them to shame honestly. The Pirelli's will be great for a single track day, then they will get slick and slick and slick. Mine are horrible now, I slid all over the place when driving even the slightest bit aggressive on the back roads near my house. In fact I probably won't know what to do when I replace the Pirellis with any other tire and I stop sliding the back end doing 30 MPH.

mustangsource said:
Just attended Track Attack Apr 16th and 2nd day in FR500S. On day 2 it was raining and they took off the slicks and mounted the BFG's for the very first time. One instructor mentioned he drove them prior and said they worked very well especially when wet. Tires on Boss were Michelin Pilot Sport which they called "sticky tires". FYI

mustangsource said:
I actually thought they handled getting hot pretty well. They only started getting greasy in the last five or so laps of the last 30 minute session in the dry. They handled the heat better than most of the street tires I have had on the track.

mustangsource said:
My only experience of the PS2's was on the first day of the track attack. Like all the reviews have said, they have a lot of grip, great feedback/feel, and are quiet (I am not sure if they were quit or not). The SC 2's were on the FR500 so it is not a direct comparison and they are probably better than I thought they were because our first session was on slicks. I feel they had better initial grip then PS2's but turn in and feedback wasn't as good and they seemed to go off more dramatically with heat than the PS2's. From my experiences that day and if money was of no concern, I would go with the PS2's, but for my budget and the price of the SC2's, I would pick the Sport Comp 2's. Like I said, they are probably even better than I thought they were considering we started the day on slicks.

mustangsource said:
Got the same feeling from the PS2's. My experience with the Sport Comps is they only got better with heat and did not seem greasy at all, great tire!!

All in all, I also stumbled upon some conflicting comments such as "SC2 do not take heat well" and yet in the post above, someone else said they get even better with more heat. The actual traction characteristics described by Vorshlag sounds ideal to me, and I would expect that the sidewall of the SC2 is stiffer than PSS (which is notoriously soft)...so if I can get more life out of the tire alone, that is worth the mild traction loss. Maybe I'll be a ginnea pig and update this thread when I try the tires out on the track. But would love to hear more feedback if anyone has any!!
 
Well, it's been 9 months since I did BTA, but recall liking the SC2s quite a lot. It was fairly cool when I was there... early May, overcast in the PM w/ high temps in the low 60s on the actual BTA day (was sunny & low 70s by the second day, but on the FR cars we ran Comp TA R1s).

Anyway, I don't recall them getting greasy when pushed or having any bad characteristics. For street tires I thought they were pretty darned good. The "hot laps" ride-along w/ an instructor driving was eye-watering. Couldn't believe what those guys can get out of our cars on street tires (although, the BTA Bosses are also running full-race Brembos up front!). I'd definitely consider them once I need to replace my Pirellis, although thinking I'll go with Rivals instead.
 
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Why oh why does the BFG website list Rivals in the correct sizes for our Bosses but then it says "Not Available"??? That is the tire I think that we all really want, right? Come on BFG!

http://www.bfgoodrichtires.com/tire-selector/name/g-force-rival-tires#techspecs
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
Thanks for posting those other opinions.

Just to share some of my *crazy* thoughts...
Out of curiosity, I've been meaning to try my 295 PSS with the 275 SC2 up front on the Boss. Just never got around to it and I don't drive the Boss in the rain. Might try it on the GT, but we've only had ~1/10" of rain so far this year.
I normally don't like to mix tires, but I think it might work out well and I prefer a directional tire for the front.
 
I have one autoX on them (square 275/40r18 on 18x9.5") and like them so far. It was a tight course and they spent 80% of the time squealing. But I am pretty new so I have nothing to compare them to other than the Pirellis which got rock hard by the end of the summer. Good tire, good price. I drive slower in the rain but have not noticed a difference in handling vs dry at 55-60mph.
 

Mad Hatter

Gotta go Faster
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Just my 2 cent worth. If you are going to track the car on street tires better of getting a symmetric one from a cost point of view. The SC2 can be flipped and rotated, the PSS can not. The PSS is better tire but, only having a outside edge will really cut back on tire life. $$$$$$
 
I loved the PSS in the rain. It was hard to believe i could do 75-80 on the open highway and feel comfortable like i did.
 
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Mad Hatter said:
Just my 2 cent worth. If you are going to track the car on street tires better of getting a symmetric one from a cost point of view. The SC2 can be flipped and rotated, the PSS can not. The PSS is better tire but, only having a outside edge will really cut back on tire life. $$$$$$

That is a really good point!
I hadn't considered that issue for PSS. That is a pretty big problem, considering that PSS sidewalls are notoriously soft. It doesn't help that both the compound and tread pattern is meant to be installed in a single direction only.

FWIW I just got quotes for the tires in stock sizes. PSS is roughly 1500 installed, SC2 is 1000 installed. It seems that you Americans also have the same tire price differential between these 2 tires as in Canada :)

From a longevity perspective, I'm leaning heavily towards SC2 now. And after hearing some positive feedback on them (they hold up to heat etc), I think I will bite the bullet and try them out. At worst, they will not be any worse than the P zero that came with the car (from what I'm reading). At best, it has better traction characteristics than the p zero, stiffer sidewalls and same levels of grip as the car had stock. That is all fine by me! I'll post up a review when I get a few lapping days in the rubbers (or if I change my mind and pick an entirely different set of tires - I read S04 are good also? lol).
 

Mad Hatter

Gotta go Faster
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I had the S04's before, similar to the Pzeros but more comfortable and much better in the wet. When I switched to the square Direzza zII's i noticed I went 10km/hour faster in one high G curve then either the S04 or Pzeros. Next step from the Dunlops will be Slicks. The Dunlops also have 8 events on them and I think I can get three more at least. The S04's gave me four.... Asymmetrical tires really do have a shorter life!!
 
Can you guys site your source that says the PSS can't be rotated?

They are not directional...

I've been doing the OEM recommended rotation pattern with mine.
 
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Bob said:
Can you guys site your source that says the PSS can't be rotated?

They are not directional...

I've been doing the OEM recommended rotation pattern with mine.

They can be rotated. They are not suppossed to be flipped. In other words unmounting the tires from the rim, flipping the inside tread to the outside, and remounting.
 
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If it helps anyone who is shopping... I found a vid of an instructor driving a GT around MMP on the BFG SC2 tires:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVwZURzcPCY

They scream for life, but they still hold their line. There are some sections where he dials in more steering to tighten the line...you hear the tire squeal increase, but it still doesn't let up on the traction. Looks better than expected for a tire of that wear rating and performance rating. (though I'm still debating. Now have eyes set on AD08R too!).
 

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