S550 HPDE Prep - Need advice

[strengthrehab]

You can do 10" square with factory camber specs. A lot has to do with spring rates too though.

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[Track Pony]

Would you be running the wide square set up all the time or just for track? I have 19X11 square on my PP (have to use a 20mm spacer in front) for track and back to OEM specs for street. This is with -2.3* camber at all times.

 

[Krispy]

I'm running a pretty similar setup as Track Pony, GTPP with Project 6GR wheels (see below tread) 19x11 square (295/30/19), -2.8* front & -2.5 rear, Steeda camber plates up front and their adjustable inner mount in the rear(PITA to install BTW). APR wheel studs & 21mm custom spacers up front, extended length narrow body closed-end lugnuts. I leave the spacers on the car for the street with the OEM front wheels. The gearing in the Performance Pack is already very short so for track work 19 makes more sense than 18's IMO, autox is a different story. Franky, even a 295/30/19 R888 isn't tall enough and I'll be trying 305's for next season to get a little more gear while also moving to the middle range of width on an 11" wheel (Toyo specs).

PS: after 10,000kms my front tires don't have any material additional wear due the camber (wear from street driving usually comes from large amounts of toe...).

https://trackmustangsonline.com/thr...-s550-mustang-gt350.10423/page-17#post-165128

 

[RES_22]

305's are good.

I had to go 22mm with PSC2's....fat SW.

 

[Wotfun]

You can do 10" square with factory camber specs. A lot has to do with spring rates too though.

Re spring rates, I'm planning on keeping the suspension stock. Do you think that'll cause rubbing with 10" wheels and camber within factory specs?

 

[Wotfun]

Would you be running the wide square set up all the time or just for track?

My original thought was to have one set of wide wheels & tires for summer daily driving and track use and a second, narrower set for winter tires.

I've considered getting four new stock wheels - staggered. My idea was to have four wheels that are the same as stock rear wheels and four the same as stock front wheels. In that scenario, I'd use the four narrower wheels for winter tires and the four wider wheels for summer & track driving.

I don't know if that would work. But, if it would, it seems like the least expensive way to have two sets of wheels.

 

[RES_22]

Careful using OE rears on front. Higher offset number causes interference... will need small spacers. Check out edmunds long-term test.

If you are wedded to narrow winter wheels...grab two OE fronts and go 9" square. Then go 11 square for track. You can grow into that setup and (ultimately) save $$$ by not having to chase speed/grip constantly buying wider track wheels.

 

[Wotfun]

Careful using OE rears on front. Higher offset number causes interference... will need small spacers. Check out edmunds long-term test.

If you are wedded to narrow winter wheels...grab two OE fronts and go 9" square. Then go 11 square for track. You can grow into that setup and (ultimately) save $$$ by not having to chase speed/grip constantly buying wider track wheels.

I'm not locked in to anything yet. My idea about the narrow winter wheels/tires comes from advice consistently shared in BMW groups. They say to get the narrowest winter tire the manufacturer says will fit the car. I think the idea is that a skinnier tire will dig through snow and, therefore, get better traction. I'm not preparing to drive the mustang in snow. Hence, not wanting to fit the narrowest wheels and tires.

But, I do expect to drive the car during winter and past experience tells me that summer tires will wear quickly and won't grip well in cold temperatures. That, coupe led with preferring a square setup made me think the stock front wheels might be good at all four corners - for winter driving. You make a good point re using the 9" square setup for winter and, in spring, upgrading to an 11" square setup for summer and HPDE driving.

You cautioned against using the wider rear OEM wheel in front requiring spacers..understood and thank you! My perception from most of the other posts is that any square setup, with wider than stock wheels in front will require spacers.

The key thing I'm looking for is a square setup that will allow rotating the tires & wheels front to back. Is that even feasible? Is it better to just pay someone to switch the tires around and not rotate the wheels?

 

[OPMustang Tim]

I'm not locked in to anything yet. My idea about the narrow winter wheels/tires comes from advice consistently shared in BMW groups. They say to get the narrowest winter tire the manufacturer says will fit the car. I think the idea is that a skinnier tire will dig through snow and, therefore, get better traction. I'm not preparing to drive the mustang in snow. Hence, not wanting to fit the narrowest wheels and tires.

But, I do expect to drive the car during winter and past experience tells me that summer tires will wear quickly and won't grip well in cold temperatures. That, coupe led with preferring a square setup made me think the stock front wheels might be good at all four corners - for winter driving. You make a good point re using the 9" square setup for winter and, in spring, upgrading to an 11" square setup for summer and HPDE driving.

You cautioned against using the wider rear OEM wheel in front requiring spacers..understood and thank you! My perception from most of the other posts is that any square setup, with wider than stock wheels in front will require spacers.

The key thing I'm looking for is a square setup that will allow rotating the tires & wheels front to back. Is that even feasible? Is it better to just pay someone to switch the tires around and not rotate the wheels?

For a winter/all season wheel set-up I would go 19x9 then just buy a set of track wheels. Depending on the snow need, and you do not require snow tires and can use a performance all season and use them all year round check out OE Wheels.

 

[Wotfun]

For a winter/all season wheel set-up I would go 19x9 then just buy a set of track wheels. Depending on the snow need, and you do not require snow tires and can use a performance all season and use them all year round check out OE Wheels.

The OE wheels seem pretty cheap. Do you have experience with them to know they're good quality?

 

[OPMustang Tim]

The OE wheels seem pretty cheap. Do you have experience with them to know they're good quality?

3 years of track use, not a single issue.

 

[RES_22]

Take Tim's advice....

 

[strengthrehab]

Was waiting for him to show up as I know he is using 19x10 square

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[stevbd]

On a s197 with 3.31 rear I use 275/40/18 MPSS on Apex 18x9.5 for HPDE and daily driving. Winter I use Blizzak 235/50/18. Both work well for their intended use. As mentioned, with the shorter gearing of a PP, I might be inclined to step up to a 19" rim. I would think twice about going much wider than maybe a 10" rim and a 285 tire if lots of daily driving. Obviously I give up traction with my smaller MPSS but the car runs easily in intermediate and advanced run groups and is two fingers straight ahead stable on the road. No bad tramlining, the tires wear nice and even, and plenty of clearance all around.

Be careful to plan the setup not only around the 5 days a year on track but also the other 360 you're going to work.

By the way, I don't think spacers are automatically required to run a wider square setup. They certainly aren't on the s197. You just need to get the offset correct.

 

[Wotfun]

Was waiting for him to show up as I know he is using 19x10 square

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So, OPmustang Tim uses 19x10 square setup for summer/track? @OPMustang Tim, are you able to rotate wheels/tires front to back? Can you please share details of your setup? Spacers? Suspension? Wheels/tires?

 

[Wotfun]

On a s197 with 3.31 rear I use 275/40/18 MPSS on Apex 18x9.5 for HPDE and daily driving. Winter I use Blizzak 235/50/18. Both work well for their intended use. As mentioned, with the shorter gearing of a PP, I might be inclined to step up to a 19" rim. I would think twice about going much wider than maybe a 10" rim and a 285 tire if lots of daily driving. Obviously I give up traction with my smaller MPSS but the car runs easily in intermediate and advanced run groups and is two fingers straight ahead stable on the road. No bad tramlining, the tires wear nice and even, and plenty of clearance all around.

Be careful to plan the setup not only around the 5 days a year on track but also the other 360 you're going to work.

By the way, I don't think spacers are automatically required to run a wider square setup. They certainly aren't on the s197. You just need to get the offset correct.

Understood. I've approached HPDEs as an opportunity to learn to get the most out of my daily driver - not with the idea of maximizing absolute speed. In my previous car, my instructor told me I was getting all the performance out of the car that I could and he recommended camber plates and stickier tires. Since I do want to continue to learn and develop my skills, I'm interested in some minor modifications from stock setup. But, the majority of my driving will be on public roads.

 

[stevbd]

Wotfun, you may already have seen this but here are the details for a 19x10 setup for your car. No spacer needed for a square setup. Spacer in front seems to be required if going square 19x11.

https://www.apexraceparts.com/shop-...stang/19x10-et40-apex-ec-7-mustang-wheel.html

I think those look amazing, they probably are what I would have done if available when I was purchasing.

EDIT: I should have added, I have those in the 18". They are pretty light and seem strong. I've hit several good size potholes and severe pavement changes in construction zones with no noticeable damage. They are kind of pain to clean with the multispoke design, especially in silver. Overall the price/performance value seems really good to me.

Good luck!

 

[SCGT500]

‘15 GT Performance Pack here. 19x10’s front and rear. Small wheel spacers in front and ARP studs front and rear. 1” eibach drop front and rear.

Run VIR few times a year. Get a light rub in the rollercoaster sometimes so went to heavier springs to try out (400 lbs)

Tires are 295/30ZR-19 toyo proxes r888r

Been running 2:15’s full course, looking for 2:10’s lol

Just some food for thought if it helps.

Would be cool to have the experience of difference types of cars on the track as you’ll soon have.

 

[Wotfun]

I really appreciate everyone taking time to answer my questions and share your insights. All of my HPDE experience has been with the BMW CCA at VIR and Summit Point. I'll probably continue to participate in the BMW schools because I've had good experiences with them. Not surprisingly, most folks at BMW CCA events are driving BMWs. But, over the last few years, I've seen a variety of cool cars, including and a few Mustangs. So, I won't feel out of place showing up in my S550. But, it would be fun to meet some of you and talk cars in person.

My #1 priority is safety; then fun and improving my driving. VIR and Summit are my most "local" tracks so, east coast mid-Atlantic region.

Who do you all recommend for HPDEs? (I recall some folks have mentioned Chin in this thread already.)

 

[VoodooBoss]

While I've always been a fan of Mustang and always wanted one what finally got me into a Mustang was the Motor Trend article between a 2011 Mustang GT 5.0 vs a 2011 BMW M3 where the BMW was only 0.1 seconds a lap slower than the BMW. This was late Summer 2010. A few weeks later the Boss 302 was announced and I jumped in with both feet. I hope you enjoy your Mustang as much as most of the TMO members do. Drive the wheels off of it!

http://www.motortrend.com/cars/bmw/m3/2011/2011-2011-ford-mustang-gt-vs-2011-bmw-m3-comparison/