This is why you don't run stock suspension...

[ajaquilante]

Respectfully... I don't care how many times you post that pic, or the fact that it was on pole, that 3 wheel motion image is not "dialed in right". That might work for that driver who has to use a LOT of curbing to defend to stay ahead of others, but that's just all kinds of wrong. The fact that you keep posting that is doing the community here no favors.

Glad the discussion of bad setups continues!

Experience and results say otherwise. But everyone is an expert on the internet, so maybe I'm one of the few that isn't.

Curb use and defending? Not sure if you are joking, or you just doesn't have the experience. The real dis-service is that most people think they need to change their car before going to drivers school because of pictures like yours.

So what are the optimal spring rates for a car not to be meme worthy and to qualify 1st, (or be fastest in a time trial) and to win a 45 minute road course race.

 

[TMSBOSS]

Great to see Several processes used to attack a common challenge. They give us mere mortals something to think about.
Declaring your route to an objective is the only way to get there........Not So Much.

I love the exchange of technical concepts. Please continue so a novice like myself can see the different ways, techniques, concept used to improve performance.

Use this site as a way to bash the other guy..... All you are doing is ensuring I never visit your site. Why?? If you wont acknowledge the techniques and opinions of others who are your peers and also successful. How in the hell can I expect you to listen to me.....to lone customer.

Something to think about......Or not. Your call.

 

[ajaquilante]

Just like ice cream, there are plenty of options. Which route gets taken is up to each person, and the options in today's world make that even easier. It used to be that you were stuck with one or two options. Each person/company has their own thoughts and theories. Some work, some don't. With DE/trackday stuff it is not as black and white as racing against a clock IMO. Everyone has different goals, so trying to educate people and give them options based on experience is the best thing to do I feel. Pushing a one-size-fits-all box at them doesn't always work. I hate it for people coming to us who purchased a long list of parts after reading how great it all was, but are un-happy, or still having issues, or caused more issues, then they have to spend even more money to fix it.

 

[Boone]

Sorry to interject when so many posters on this thread know so much more to me (not sarcasm btw). But, I can see why Fair and Phoenix set their cars up differently.

Fair is a time trial guy, and Pheonix is w2w. Speed at certain portions of the track are more important than an overall lap time in w2w. The launch on a soft setup is very important to reach a passing zone 1st.

Also, Fair isn't limited in rear tire size, so he doesn't need to transfer as much weight to the rear. W2w guys are usually more restricted in their setups to even the field.

This is not a right or wrong thing. We just need to take a moment to put things in context.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[TymeSlayer]

I remember letting Pemberton drive my car last September in Hastings. He uttered quite a few whimsical German words and I thought he was gonna puke. But it works for me in my HPDE world and I keep improving my tymes. Whomever said it's not one size fits all, pretty much sumed it all up.

 

[Norm Peterson]

The real dis-service is that most people think they need to change their car before going to drivers school because of pictures like yours.

This ↑↑↑ .

Most people already tend to associate being out there at speed on a for-real race track with a need for the car to have had wholesale changes made to it. Pictures with disparaging commentary only serve to strengthen that association, and there's a tendency to forget one's own one-time or occasional observations when the advertising copy is only a couple of mouse clicks away.

Never mind the more aggressive email-based advertising campaigns, with subject lines that read in part something like "Your Mustang demands ..." (I'm looking at AM in particular here).


Norm

 

[Norm Peterson]

Just to confirm, your Rollsteer chart is a dimensionless degreeº/degreeº vs. ride height? I would think this would be a 3D chart including ride height, or a 2D chart with curvature for a single given ride height. I don't think of roll steer as a linear property.

I did take a crack at this and what I think I'm finding is a very gentle "U" shape in the roll steer surface plot as the amount of roll varies from zero at any given ride height. Not quite a flat plane, but not too far off either.


Norm

 

[Mad Hatter]

I just had to put this in...these RWD live axle wonders won many championships from 1967 to 1971, and where competitive for a while longer..... Maybe we have seen this before...??? (or after...)

 

[ArizonaBOSS]

I didn't realize the Aquilantes were into Alfas back then

 

[Mad Hatter]

Maybe this is another relative???