Tire Warmers

[antman450]

When I race street bikes, we always use tire warmers that dramatically extend tire life since they do not cool between sessions. It is true that the cost and time to setup is much less on a motorcycle. I have however noticed twice the usable tire age when compared to before I used them. These are on a motorcycle equivalent of an R comp or slick.

That got me thinking about why we do not use them on our track/race cars. I would imagine you can turn 4 sessions into one long heat cycle, albeit jacking up the car and putting them on is more work than on a 350 pound two wheeled bike. Is it not however worth the time for extending tire life and setting hot tire pressures in the pits. On my car, two jacks and I got the car up in the air in 3 minutes. Wrap them up and your good to go. I mean this is a 10 minute job. But imagine tire life, since we all know a tire will cycle out way before the rubber is gone.

Thoughts, opinions, criticism are all welcome here. Cost would be made up in just one set of tires lasting twice their normal days/sessions on track. And if not power at the track, a small generator would be more than adequate. Like a $400 one. Again, one set of tires would cover that too if they last twice as long.

 

[Dallas Brown]

Ive wondered the same thing and have considered just trying it out myself. The motorcycle and car pits are a little different when it comes to tires I've noticed. Its almost like the car guys try to keep their tires cool in the pits where with bikes our tires would be on warmers the entire day. The car warmers are considerably more expensive, but when I start buying Hoosiers I think I might try it to attempt to extend the life. The warmers don't just save our bike tires from heat cycling out, but also from cold tearing and allow being able to go fast right on our first lap.

 

[Grant 302]

I think you're right. I'd need help to get it done in a reasonable time.

 

[antman450]

I wonder about the Chinese ones on eBay for $500. They seem to have very good feedback and reviews. US brands are 4 times that. I use Chicken Hawk for my motorcycle. Had them for almost 10 years. But they are much cheaper than car ones.

I get my bike ones on the tires is 5 minutes. So, car would not take me more than ten minutes. I have rotated tires and torques the nuts and adjusted pressure in about 10 minutes. Can't imagine this would take much longer.

 

[JAJ]

I looked at the CHR website and a couple of things came to mind - don't know if I'm right, but I'm sure someone here knows:

1. You'll probably need jacking rails and a set of jackstands. The warmers go on the tires when the vehicle is in the air, so you need an easy and quick way to get it up there and keep it there.

2. The generator could be quite sizeable. From an article published on the CHR site, it looks like 550 watts per front tire and 600 watts per tire on the rear tire for motorcycle warmers. Car warmers would use even more power. That's probably around a 3000 watt generator or even bigger.

 

[Grant 302]

I'd still take temps and pressures first. It would be better to have someone follow and cover the tires as that's done.

 

[antman450]

Generator may not be too feasible but then again you can get a 4000 running watt for $450 or 7000 for $700. Most tracks have electricity, so I do not see this as a big deal. I need a generator anyway.

I use jack stands and if it even takes me 15 minutes, it would be worth it. But, that's just me.

More importantly, I just wonder IF IT WILL HELP turn 4 heat cycles into one if used between a four session day, or even if it turns it relatively into two cycles. Even 150% to 200% better tire life is beyond worth it to me. Two sets of tires would pay for the warmers and generator.

 

[JeffV8]

Get a quiet generator nothing worse than Listening to someone’s cheap generator

 

[antman450]

For what it's worth. A friend and I made a DIY muffler that works amazing. Often we even wondered if the thing was running. Google DIY generator muffler and there are a million ideas.

It helps that I was consulting for Magnaflow at the time so had free access to all materials I needed.

 

[VoodooBoss]

It's an interesting idea and I hope it works. F1 uses tire warmers so they can go out and put down fast lap times immediately. They're not worried about heat cycles. A friend of mine tracks his bike with racing tires and he says the tire warmers are necessary at Laguna Seca because the track can be so cool in the mornings. Without them it's like riding on ice cubes until heat builds in the tires. Slick tires are a lot more of a concern on a motorcycle for obvious reasons.

 

[antman450]

It's an interesting idea and I hope it works. F1 uses tire warmers so they can go out and put down fast lap times immediately. They're not worried about heat cycles. A friend of mine tracks his bike with racing tires and he says the tire warmers are necessary at Laguna Seca because the track can be so cool in the mornings. Without them it's like riding on ice cubes until heat builds in the tires. Slick tires are a lot more of a concern on a motorcycle for obvious reasons.

On my motorcycle, that is definitely the case. Race tires are like riding on ice until warm. One wrong move with cold tires and whoosh and you high side. I have seen most crashes happen in the first or second lap. That being said, I have been racing motorcycles for 20 years. I run racing DOT tires. Basically slicks with a few small grooves. Like an A7 or R7. Ever since using tire warmers, I now get 4 days out of them. I used to get two before lap times fell off and bike started sliding around under me. That was 15 years ago and never looked back. True, they take 5 min to install since bike is on a stand anyway. I do not have a kickstand. But as I mentioned before, I will gladly do this on a car if it extends usable tire life.

 

[blacksheep-1]

FWIW, they are illegal in most sanctioning bodies, a few years ago an IMSA team was docked about $10K for stacking thir tires in front of a heater at Daytona when the outside temp was in the 30s..
That being said, tire warmers could definitely help in qualifying, but...but...you're going to have to up your game on tire pressure and temps with regards to data entries. And..since most HPDE guys are 1 or 2 person teams, that will just add to the "to do " list between sessions.
Again, it all comes back to setting pressures in the AM, and record keeping, warmers or not, and even then, you'll still have to compensate for track and ambient temps.
or...just don't overdrive the car on the outlap

 

[Bill Pemberton]

Dang, another killer comment by Blacksheep, as I was thinking this idea was illegal ,but was just not that sure? Black was not sheepish and again comes up with solid advice that saves all of us the expense of contemplating doing what sounded like an interesting idea.

 

[Bouncing Soul]

It's an interesting idea and I hope it works. F1 uses tire warmers so they can go out and put down fast lap times immediately. They're not worried about heat cycles. A friend of mine tracks his bike with racing tires and he says the tire warmers are necessary at Laguna Seca because the track can be so cool in the mornings. Without them it's like riding on ice cubes until heat builds in the tires. Slick tires are a lot more of a concern on a motorcycle for obvious reasons.

I had a cold tire crash on my motorcycle *with* warmers at Laguna.

Personally I wouldn’t bother with this in cars unless I had air jacks. Too much hassle.

 

[Grant 302]

I had a cold tire crash on my motorcycle *with* warmers at Laguna.

Personally I wouldn’t bother with this in cars unless I had air jacks. Too much hassle.

That's a more practical way to put it.

I envy one of my friends who has his son perform pit crew duties. Even then, this would be a lot to do for a two man team.