Tires slipping on track wheels

Discussion in 'Brakes, Wheels and Tires' started by Black Boss, Aug 22, 2014.

  1. Black Boss

    Black Boss TMO Addict

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    The Nitto's are also slipping on the Enkei's. Here's a pic after 1 session. Valve was originally aligned with silver line:

    [​IMG]

    Other side:

    [​IMG]
     
  2. steveespo

    steveespo Lord knows I'm a Voodoo Child Moderator

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    That's crazy. Are you getting vibrations now? I'll have to mark my tires though I don't think they're moving.
    Steve
     
  3. Black Boss

    Black Boss TMO Addict

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    No vibrations yet. Plan to get the wheels re-balanced before next weekend though.

    I first noticed it with Conti's -- I wasn't marking them and got crazy vibration on front left from Mid Ohio, which has hard braking from about 130. Turned out it had slipped.

    Talked to my Tire guy and he's using the minimum lube he can to get the tires on. I know some of the race wheels have knurled tire beads. Maybe the Enkei's are on the small side?
     
  4. 06mach1

    06mach1 TMO Addict

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    They slip on my Forgestars also.
     
  5. VoodooBoss

    VoodooBoss Rick Moderator

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    Do the Forgestars have knurling?
     
  6. 06mach1

    06mach1 TMO Addict

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    Not that I recall.
     
  7. ArizonaBOSS

    ArizonaBOSS Because racecar. Moderator

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    FWIW I don't even balance my race tires once they're mounted anymore. No issues with vibrations. Just mount em up and go--because they're gonna slip anyways.
     
  8. Roadhouse

    Roadhouse Logan

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    I don't balance mine either...I've never marked my tires but I'm sure they slip on the wheel.
     
  9. JScheier

    JScheier Too Hot for the Boss!

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    ^This!
     
  10. steveespo

    steveespo Lord knows I'm a Voodoo Child Moderator

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    We should discuss this because I have always balanced all types of tire and some of the race tires require a lot of weight in different locations to get zeroed out. If they are just mounted up wouldn't the vibrations or potential vibrations be damaging to suspension components? Also bearings? What is everyone experiencing, a lot of shake, low frequency rumbles etc.?
    Steve
     
  11. ArizonaBOSS

    ArizonaBOSS Because racecar. Moderator

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    TBH I asked the same kinds of questions when I learned my wheels were only being mounted and not balanced. From an engineering standpoint, there are going to be eccentric imbalances caused this way, but I really haven't experienced any vibrations or damage etc. Been running this way since last year.

    I do change front hubs each year as a preventive measure, however.

    Another thing to think about, in addition to the tire slippage on the rim, is the amount of tire "clagg" or marbles that accumulate inside the wheel during a session. This also creates an imbalance and there's not much you can do about it (although I've heard a thin spray layer of cooking spray in the wheel barrel will help). When I do have vibration issues, they have always been cured by cleaning all the tire crap out of the wheel barrels.
     
  12. 302 Hi Pro

    302 Hi Pro Boss 302 - Racing Legend to Modern Muscle Car

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    This is very interesting and timely information for me as I have two sets of Continental Race Slicks, (scrubs with 5-6/32's), to mount on my 18X10 (squared set up) Drift wheels. Hoping to run 2 track days in late September early October 2014. I didn't see if this conversation is referring to new race tires only, or if it would apply to scrubs as well? I have heated and scraped the exterior and have wiped down and cleaned the inner carcass each tire. Thanks in Advance for your information, thoughts and opinions.
    2HP
     
  13. VoodooBoss

    VoodooBoss Rick Moderator

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    I read this question a few days ago so I checked several stacks of tires yesterday at the WC race and didn't find balancing weights on any wheels.
     
  14. ArizonaBOSS

    ArizonaBOSS Because racecar. Moderator

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    Applicable to both stickers and scrubs--I've run em both, multiple tire types, mount only, no balancing.
     
  15. steveespo

    steveespo Lord knows I'm a Voodoo Child Moderator

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    My next set will be index mounted only and see how it feels. Maybe I'll save $5 a tire
     
  16. wwilde001

    wwilde001 TMO Addict

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    Wow. I'll have to mark my tires this weekend and see if mine are slipping on the BBS Wheels. The race shop that did the original setup mounted and balanced my first set. And this weekend at the IMSA Tudor event, the Continental Tent had a whole row of balancing machines.
    Just my personal experience and observations.
     
  17. JScheier

    JScheier Too Hot for the Boss!

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    That's all I do. Use the dots on the tires as designed and should have limited vibrations.

    I will say 1) take offs may not have index marks 2) I did have some vibrations at Road America above 145mph. Wasn't bad and may have easily been attributable to the amount of clag/OPR built up inside my wheels each session.

    Also, I stopped balancing non-street tires when I began autoxing cars which were not equipped with ABS. One tire lock up = flat spot = no longer in balance. 86 GT + 347 -ABS = lots of threshold braking mistakes :)
     
  18. Black Boss

    Black Boss TMO Addict

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    Got the the wheels rebalanced. Cleaned off the tire worms etc, and weights were pretty much the same, but rotated in line with slippage. As many as 10 weights on 2 rims.

    On non balanced wheels, in addition to hub life, I'd be concerned about ball joints. I got a lot of vibration on the first set of Contis that slipped.

    Would be good to know what all the race teams do re balancing and hub/ ball joint replacement.
     
  19. 302 Hi Pro

    302 Hi Pro Boss 302 - Racing Legend to Modern Muscle Car

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    Thank you AZBoss.
    2HP
     
  20. cosm3os

    cosm3os TMO Addict

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    This is totally normal. Slippage happens on every type of rim/tire combo on the track. For this and all the reasons discussed re pickup, balancing race tires is totally useless.
     

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