1st official autoX test/tune day

[Silversurfer410]

Completed my first test and tune within autoX. Had a blast! this car is so much more capable than what I can drive right now. I will be competing in the points event next month, BUT this understeer is kicking my butt. I know with my setup 285/30/19 - 325/30/19 those rear tires are just overpowering the the front causing me the all this understeer. Maybe after this season, I will go with a 305 or 315 front to try and resolve this understeer. I feel as if I can be so much more faster around the course with less understeer. As you can tell from the photos its mainly euros and JDM, I'm the only "hot rod" as they say so trying to prove this is more than a "hot rod" and it can run with the best of 'Em.

BTW added in the accelerometer..... What are you guys pulling for G-force?

 

[mavisky]

Great job getting out there, but your assessment is accurate. you'd probably be faster on a 285/285 setup than your 285/325 setup.

 

[JDee]

305 or 315 square is the hot setup. You'll need 22-25mm spacers up front and extended ARP wheel studs. You can use washers to find out how much spacer you'll need. The difference it makes in the car is worth it, absolutely. These cars are front heavy and you need all the tire you can get up front.

 

[Silversurfer410]

305 or 315 square is the hot setup. You'll need 22-25mm spacers up front and extended ARP wheel studs. You can use washers to find out how much spacer you'll need. The difference it makes in the car is worth it, absolutely. These cars are front heavy and you need all the tire you can get up front.

I was just reading that with one of the older on post on here. I seen someone mention opmustang.com and that where I would be going along with Vorshlag camber plates. Right now its waaaay to pushy in turns.

 

[Bill Pemberton]

Old Autocross trick if the front is pushing ( with basically stock cars ) is to pump up the front tires more than the rear. It won't get rid of your issue , but it may help a little.

The trick for CAMC cars is to run 315s or even 325s , square, though the 315 set up is the most common. JDee gave you the right idea and OPMustang has both the spacers and usually some longer ARP studs for your hubs. Another good choice for longer studs is Capaldi Racing ( another site Sponsor ) as they actually make the set-ups for Ford Performance.

 

[mavisky]

305 or 315 square is the hot setup. You'll need 22-25mm spacers up front and extended ARP wheel studs. You can use washers to find out how much spacer you'll need. The difference it makes in the car is worth it, absolutely. These cars are front heavy and you need all the tire you can get up front.

Agreed, I'm on a 305 square setup now but planning my next wheel and tire setup already.

 

[Silversurfer410]

305 or 315 square is the hot setup. You'll need 22-25mm spacers up front and extended ARP wheel studs. You can use washers to find out how much spacer you'll need. The difference it makes in the car is worth it, absolutely. These cars are front heavy and you need all the tire you can get up front.

Once I add everything that you mentioned, are you saying the understeer will be minimal if not gone?

 

[JDee]

Once I add everything that you mentioned, are you saying the understeer will be minimal if not gone?

Nope. It will be better but no matter what you do to the suspension you still have to manage the driver part. The car is always going to be front heavy and if you charge corners you're going to fight understeer forever.

Get the braking mostly done in a straight line, very smooth turn in to keep the front end working, gently start to pick up the throttle, balance the car to the apex and smoothly get back into the throttle hard on exit. Sudden, jerky moves with steering, brakes or throttle near the limits of adhesion are not going to have a good ending.

It takes time and practice to make this happen without having to consciously think your way through it, but once you have it you'll never lose it and it will just flow naturally.

 

[Silversurfer410]

Nope. It will be better but no matter what you do to the suspension you still have to manage the driver part. The car is always going to be front heavy and if you charge corners you're going to fight understeer forever.

Get the braking mostly done in a straight line, very smooth turn in to keep the front end working, gently start to pick up the throttle, balance the car to the apex and smoothly get back into the throttle hard on exit. Sudden, jerky moves with steering, brakes or throttle near the limits of adhesion are not going to have a good ending.

It takes time and practice to make this happen without having to consciously think your way through it, but once you have it you'll never lose it and it will just flow naturally.

Thanks man! sounds like at this point its driver mod time. Car mods can only get you so far. This was my 2nd test and tune event. 1st was in the wet which I had to drive completely different. Will just keep attending test and tune days along with competing, maybe lol. What I plan on doing for the next event is adjust the rear sway bar to the stiffest setting and soften the front up until I'm able to run a square setup.

 

[mavisky]

You can always induce understeer or oversteer with poor driving. What you want to do is get the car to behave in a positive and consistent manner when driven consistently with good fundamentals. Moving to a square setup helps with that as you currently have a nose heavy car with significantly smaller front tires than rear tires. This configuration is almost impossible to "tune" your way out of with suspension adjustment without inducing such poor handling characteristics that you'd be making sacrificed elsewhere with the car.

Keep working on the time behind the wheel as that's the single biggest change you can make if you're new. Also ask for ride-a-longs as a passenger in other experienced driver's cars and ask them to ride in your car and provide feedback if they're willing. Be open to suggestions and advice and you'll grow in your capabilities.

 

[Silversurfer410]

You can always induce understeer or oversteer with poor driving. What you want to do is get the car to behave in a positive and consistent manner when driven consistently with good fundamentals. Moving to a square setup helps with that as you currently have a nose heavy car with significantly smaller front tires than rear tires. This configuration is almost impossible to "tune" your way out of with suspension adjustment without inducing such poor handling characteristics that you'd be making sacrificed elsewhere with the car.

Keep working on the time behind the wheel as that's the single biggest change you can make if you're new. Also ask for ride-a-longs as a passenger in other experienced driver's cars and ask them to ride in your car and provide feedback if they're willing. Be open to suggestions and advice and you'll grow in your capabilities.

I will be taking advantage of all the Autox track days I can to build the skill. There is HPDE event end of may I might try out. I know its a way different ball game but curious to see how road racing is.

 

[Bill Pemberton]

Do an HPDE , as it is a good transition from autocrossing. You will feel like you have plenty of time to set up for each turn, chicane, brake point, etc. and though many disagree I believe doing both of these driving events builds upon your skillset!

 

[mavisky]

Do an HPDE , as it is a good transition from autocrossing. You will feel like you have plenty of time to set up for each turn, chicane, brake point, etc. and though many disagree I believe doing both of these driving events builds upon your skillset!

So true. I recently worked with a friend of mine who was an avid HPDE instructor and introduced him to autocross. I laughed when he asked if I wanted to setup in helmet comms for "communicating during the run". I had to inform him that if he was going slow enough that we had time to have any meaningful discussion while on course that we had bigger things to worry about.

 

[Bill Pemberton]

I love the intensity of autocrossing and I am spoiled driving my son's EVO 9 as things happen even sooner than in many vehicles. It makes running on a road course feel like I am in slow motion and that helps you pick your turn in points and more to a very fine degree of exactness.