This is the Build Thread for Black Betty. Reply below.
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SN95 Black Betty Build Thread Profile - SN95 Mustangs
- Thread startersteve_garnjobst
- Start date
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- Thread starter
- #2
Picked up this car about a month ago, so I haven’t had much time for building it out yet.
The good news is I found a car with great bones and a lot of the hard stuff already done. Only 82K miles, and little to no rust underneath. The previous owner was a Ford Master Tech, and did a beautiful job on the Coyote engine swap. He also made a fair number of upgrades I can keep.
The biggest priorities over the Winter:
1. Improve the suspension, including MM torque arm & panhard bar. I may upgrade to a Watts link eventually, but I have a lot of other things to sort out, so going the easy route and trying not to overthink the build. I have a set of QA1 double adjustable coilovers on the way. Their headquarters is about 10 minutes from my house, which is convenient.
2. Get the right tires under the car. Over the years, I’ve learned not to mess around with the wrong tires for autox. 315/30-18 A052’s seem to be the best tire for the class, so I’ll be installing some Maier Racing flares to create enough space for those tires on 11” wide wheels.
I’ll do a few other tweaks to reduce weight, improve gearing, and add power - but the top two items should be key to making the car competitive in year 1.
The good news is I found a car with great bones and a lot of the hard stuff already done. Only 82K miles, and little to no rust underneath. The previous owner was a Ford Master Tech, and did a beautiful job on the Coyote engine swap. He also made a fair number of upgrades I can keep.
The biggest priorities over the Winter:
1. Improve the suspension, including MM torque arm & panhard bar. I may upgrade to a Watts link eventually, but I have a lot of other things to sort out, so going the easy route and trying not to overthink the build. I have a set of QA1 double adjustable coilovers on the way. Their headquarters is about 10 minutes from my house, which is convenient.
2. Get the right tires under the car. Over the years, I’ve learned not to mess around with the wrong tires for autox. 315/30-18 A052’s seem to be the best tire for the class, so I’ll be installing some Maier Racing flares to create enough space for those tires on 11” wide wheels.
I’ll do a few other tweaks to reduce weight, improve gearing, and add power - but the top two items should be key to making the car competitive in year 1.
Bill Pemberton
0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
Solid machine and some really nice mods, but I am glad you are going right to a killer tire as your best go fast mod. CAM was dominated by RE71RSs and AO52s at the Solo Nationals - with a smattering of CR-Ss and Falken RT660s. Only one trophy each for the last two Brands. Rumors are heavy that Bridgestone will have a 315/18 in 2024 as they were hanging right with 315 AO52s with their narrow 295s ---- love to see tire wars as we are the ones who win!!
I expect that it won't be long before 302Bob sees this thread and posts " Black Betty" by Ram Jam to put a little music to your beasts build!
I expect that it won't be long before 302Bob sees this thread and posts " Black Betty" by Ram Jam to put a little music to your beasts build!
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- Thread starter
- #4
Yeah, not messing around with the tires. It will take some surgery to fit 315’s in front, but wider clearly appears faster in CAMT.
I have multiple seasons of experience with both the A052 and Re-71RS. Other than needing to be more careful managing tire temps, I prefer the feel of the A052, and seem to run a bit faster on them.
We managed the A052 fairly well in a 300WHP FWD car, and the Mustang should be a little easier. It helps living further North, with only a handful of really hot event days.
I have multiple seasons of experience with both the A052 and Re-71RS. Other than needing to be more careful managing tire temps, I prefer the feel of the A052, and seem to run a bit faster on them.
We managed the A052 fairly well in a 300WHP FWD car, and the Mustang should be a little easier. It helps living further North, with only a handful of really hot event days.
Bill, I found that Black Betty song.....I never heard of Ram Jam before......
Bill Pemberton
0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
Oh, but you had to have heard the song, it was even a hit in Kansas and Nebraska!
This is the first? Come on, Bob! Bam a lam!
It must be that sheltered life I lead.............I've been lost since they cancelled American Bandstand..................
- 6,405
- 8,304
Stay with a torque arm, I'm no fan of Watts stuff
- Thread starter
- #10
Placed some orders this week for a few upgrades:
1. Maximum Motorsports heavy-duty torque arm and panhard bar.
2. Ford Performance 3.73 ring & pinion
3. Maier Racing fender flares
I also have a rear seat delete kit and adjustable clutch cable to install.
That should keep me busy for a while!
1. Maximum Motorsports heavy-duty torque arm and panhard bar.
2. Ford Performance 3.73 ring & pinion
3. Maier Racing fender flares
I also have a rear seat delete kit and adjustable clutch cable to install.
That should keep me busy for a while!
Bill Pemberton
0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
Will look killer with Mike's racing fenders -- plus you can put some fat meats underneath!
- Thread starter
- #12
Betty’s currently in the shop getting a 3.73 ring & pinion installed. Turns out the axles were worn, so I’m upgrading to 31 spline axles and replacing the clutch diff with a 31 spline TrueTrac helical diff while the car’s torn apart. One less thing to deal with later.
PatientZero
@restless_performance
I'd be surprised if a 315 was much faster if any than a 295 on a 11" wheel. For sure on a 12 or 13 but the Yoks run so wide I don't think there is any benefit on a 11.
- Thread starter
- #14
The 315’s are measurably faster on an 11” wheel, at least for autocross, where a few tenths are huge. Results may be different for track use.
Note: Yokohama specifies a recommended wheel width range of 10.5” - 11.5” for the 315/30R18 A052.
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PatientZero
@restless_performance
I'm not saying I'm right, I'm just saying I haven't seen it. Most recently Dave was killing us with a 295 on a 12. Many people I know have switched from 315's to 295's on a 11.
Bill Pemberton
0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
There is some truth that DaveW was doing well switching to smaller RE71RSs from A052s, but I would be cautious saying this is the way to go as others were on Yokes ( wider tread ) and were also winning and doing well. I do believe the book is still out on this, especially since so many other variables are in the mix ( car make, suspension set up , and tire brand ) and with rumors of a 315 from Bridgerocks popping up in 2024 one might find a swing during the year. After 43 years playing in SCCA I have found whatever tire I buy there will be another brand pop up a week later that is quicker. I feel both of you are right to an extent, and though many think the Internet gives us those instant answers, drivers are finding instead it means study time and following trends is actually a part of staying up with the fast paced changes of today.
PatientZero
@restless_performance
I'm definitely not saying a 315 isn't faster, for sure it is. I'm just questioning whether using it on a 11" is faster.
Bill Pemberton
0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
Yet, tire size is often an item to question, as even forty plus years ago I ran in a Class where we all jumped to a wider tire only to find the narrower one was the hot ticket. So staying aware of changes or questioning tires ( brands , widths, compounds, upgrades ) is still the key to going a bit faster. They are the single most important factor to going faster on track/autocross , hence the reason so many of us Ancient Asphalt Assaulters preach to newcomers that they should be the first mod made if one wants quicker times. Keep up the comments as it is not uncommon to find a change occurring when one least expects it. DaveW was a good example, where with his set up on his S197 , skinny little Bridgerocks proved to be a game changer for him.
- Thread starter
- #19
Definitely a lot of course, site & weather variables at play. For local courses in MN, the car will probably be fastest on 295’s, as our primary site is a bit narrow and transition-heavy. Plus, our early & late season events are usually cold.
For Lincoln in warm weather, I want as much tire as possible.
I’m not really a fan of the RE-71RS. They worked OK in Lincoln, but really don’t seem to do well on low traction surfaces, which I run on more frequently than not. We picked up over a second at a Michelin Proving Grounds event last year by swapping from RE-71s to A052s. The A052s are a bit vague, but they stick well on just about any surface.
FWIW - I’ll probably end up with a set of 295s and a set of 315s at some point. I just need to sell off a couple sets of wheels from my last car to make space in my tire rack.
For Lincoln in warm weather, I want as much tire as possible.
I’m not really a fan of the RE-71RS. They worked OK in Lincoln, but really don’t seem to do well on low traction surfaces, which I run on more frequently than not. We picked up over a second at a Michelin Proving Grounds event last year by swapping from RE-71s to A052s. The A052s are a bit vague, but they stick well on just about any surface.
FWIW - I’ll probably end up with a set of 295s and a set of 315s at some point. I just need to sell off a couple sets of wheels from my last car to make space in my tire rack.
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PatientZero
@restless_performance
I went through two sets of Yoks before my current Bridgestones. I like the Bridgestones much better but the Yoks are the way to go if it's cool. I may switch back to Yoks this year but I'm still undecided. At the CAM Challenge in Lincoln it was cool in the morning with a sub 30 sec course and I think that hurt me a little compared to the guys runnings Yoks. In the afternoon when it warmed up a little I was able to keep pace.
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