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OMG.....another tire indecision by a newbie! sorry in advance!

Mark Bedel

TMO Intermediate
21
25
Gibsonia, PA
Welcome to the group! Because of who we are, and what we enjoy, we have a tendency to like to throw money at things. I'm as guilty of this as the next. I can say this though, if you have not had formal training on a track, or another type of performance driving experience, as suggested above, you first few times out...the car will more than likely NOT be the limiter. As you learn the track, and develop your skills, you'll be able begin improvements. Camber plates are huge though. They save the outside edges of your tires no matter the width, and insure that what rubber you do have is actually working for you.
 

Meateater

TMO Intermediate
26
18
Minnesota
HPDE
5-10 Years
Welcome to the addiction! Tons of great advice here Doug! I started with a giant hog for a track car, 2006 Dodge Charger. Ate breaks like a fat guy with a cake! Especially fronts. With that car I focused on brakes and suspension. It made the car safer, more predictable and more fun. Upgrade tires/wheels came later. Beware though when you track orient your set up, you make it less comfortable on the street. Especially in the NE during the winter. (I'm in MN and the Charger became undriveable in snow due to clearance issues and aero.) One of my instructors told me to spend money on seat time then on mods. Good advice for me. Now with my Shelby, starting at a very different place, seat time is still the focus. Regardless, have fun. Its your money so spend it how you want! Cool factor is still a consideration! 😆
 

Meateater

TMO Intermediate
26
18
Minnesota
HPDE
5-10 Years
Welcome to the group! Because of who we are, and what we enjoy, we have a tendency to like to throw money at things. I'm as guilty of this as the next. I can say this though, if you have not had formal training on a track, or another type of performance driving experience, as suggested above, you first few times out...the car will more than likely NOT be the limiter. As you learn the track, and develop your skills, you'll be able begin improvements. Camber plates are huge though. They save the outside edges of your tires no matter the width, and insure that what rubber you do have is actually working for you.
Great points Mark! Not too many of us can really out drive our machines! And I'm with you on the camber plates. The Vorshlags are what the doctor ordered on my car.
 

Mark Bedel

TMO Intermediate
21
25
Gibsonia, PA
Great points Mark! Not too many of us can really out drive our machines! And I'm with you on the camber plates. The Vorshlags are what the doctor ordered on my car.
Those are exactly the one's I'm using. Those gents are great also at helping you decide on progressive upgrades. I also purchased a ForgeStar wheelset from them...another great addition...among others.
 

Grant Osborn

TMO Beginner
Welcome to TMO!....Great advice given by all. One extremely important detail left out in your brake upgrade(unless i missed it) are stainless steel braided brake lines when you upgrade to a 60 dot fluid and/or a much more aggressive pad. My local track will not pass you in tech if you have upgraded your pads to a track pad without these lines installed. Also do your homework before you just throw a set of racing pads on your Mustang. A lot of racing pads are not made for stock rotors and vice versa. You can go through your rotors like butter if the components aren't a close match. As for wheels and tires you cant go wrong with Nitto NT01'S mounted on Apex Racing Wheels....Apex wheels are light weight which will help in braking due to less unsprung weight. The Nittos are an excellent track tire and wear reasonably well. Always best to have an extra set of harder compound street wheels/tires to swap out for daily driving......It's a lot to absorb at first but the main thing is to go out there and have fun!....Learn your craft, be smooth and don't worry about being fast... The speed will come with seat time!......Grant!
 

Scootsmcgreggor

TMO Advanced
176
157
CA
Welcome to TMO!....Great advice given by all. One extremely important detail left out in your brake upgrade(unless i missed it) are stainless steel braided brake lines when you upgrade to a 60 dot fluid and/or a much more aggressive pad. My local track will not pass you in tech if you have upgraded your pads to a track pad without these lines installed.
Interesting this is the first time I’ve heard/read this. Can you please elaborate why some organizations won’t pass you in tech with race pads and stock lines?
 

Grant Osborn

TMO Beginner
Interesting this is the first time I’ve heard/read this. Can you please elaborate why some organizations won’t pass you in tech with race pads and stock lines?
To be honest with you I don't know the exact reason. I ran my 03' supercharged Mach 1 one through tech inspection at Willow Springs with West Coast Racing a few years back and the only comment I received was regarding the race pads and the stainless lines being a must. Having already installed them on the car I really didn't think much about it or question the reasoning until now. The stainless lines were provided with the The Stop Tech racing brakes that are currently on the car(fronts), rears were purchased separately. However they should be installed. I do know that the stock rubber section connected to the calipers have a tendency to become a bit soft after heating up and are a contributing factor to brake fade under continuous extreme braking conditions. Generally speaking they should be a part of any race, hpde, track day vehicles brakes upgrade.....I'll have to do a bit of research regarding the racing brake pads on stock calipers, lines etc.. Thanks for bringing this to my attention! Cheers!........Grant!
 

Bill Pemberton

0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
5,102
3,499
Blair, Nebraska
W2W Racing
20+ Years
I would wager to guess the thoughts concerning racing pads at Willow are likely due to the high speeds attainable there. Apparently the group is trying to protect both the participants and themselves. I may be in Nebraska , but I have quite a few friends in California and it seems going off track at Willow is not if , it is when! There are other tracks in the US that will often suggest things like having a recent brake flush, bringing extra pads , checking your rotors , etc. in their supplemental regs. This info is almost always at fast tracks or ones that have plenty of severe braking zones and I have often found Instructing that brakes do not get the respect they deserve. Folks are often told , when they are new , that stock pads are fine, fresh fluid is fine, etc. and then they get to the track and the Instructor finds out the driver is ultra aggressive or rides his brakes. Instruction often is nothing more than getting rid of bad habits , but some habits can cause major issues. Brakes are right at the top for track prep and yet over the years they often seem to be down the line on a driver's mod list. Often the main thing needed is a high quality DOT 4 fluid, aggressive pads, with the next step ( in my mind ) being ducting.

Note: the listing of 60 DOT fluid I believe is a typo and is suggesting using a 600 degree dry boiling point fluid ( DOT 4 ) like Motul 600.
 
Last edited:

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
Stainless lines are not required anywhere I know of. Last thing I wanna read here is somebody saying, “Grant said stainless brake lines are required...”

Whoever told you that was wrong or there was some misunderstanding.
 

Grant Osborn

TMO Beginner
Pretty effed right?

Hopefully, only one is the internet correcting variety.
Ok...calm down folks....I am the other Grant.... I certainly didn't expect to get in a pissing contest with everyone.... I merely shared my personal experience at an open track day event in the hopes that Doug would understand the importance of braided stainless lines in the overall brake upgrade package. And Bill, yes you are correct that was a typo on the brake fluid....As Bill mentioned the braking zones at high speed tracks such as Willow Springs are extreme and will eventually render brake fade after several laps on stock brakes......As far as HPDE and parking lot cone crushing?.... I don't know......I've never signed up for either one.....;)
 

TMSBOSS

Epic Contributor
5,651
2,620
Illinois
HPDE
5-10 Years
Grant. All good. This site does have a sense of humor. Sometimes hard for the new folks to recognize.
Grant 302 is a long time valued member of this site. He does have a tendency to point out differences in techniques while bring valued content to the site. He is family and I am sure took the joke/poke as just that.

There is enough room for two Grants, of course. Welcome to the site.
 

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