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Race Brake Pads

28
19
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Charlotte
Could I ask what difference you felt running R16/R10 vs R16/R12?
My (Carbotech equivalent) rear pads wore out so much faster than my fronts, so I'm investigating the forum to see if I need to bump it up from 10 to 12, or if that'll even have any effect on it lol
Shot in the dark…. Did you run some sessions with traction control and/or AdvanceTrak engaged? Heavy rear pad wear could be from those systems applying lots of rear brake.
 

Bill Pemberton

0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
7,000
6,142
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Blair, Nebraska
blvckgt -----a Carbotech 10 is more like a G-Loc 8 and I found on my Boss S that the rears went much quicker than the fronts when I was on 8s, so I moved up to 10s. So with the Carbotechs you probably might want to use 12s in the rear and see how that works? The other item I would ask is what were you using up front? This may not be the answer in your case , but I did find they rears wearing quicker than I expected when I had run G-Loc 8s.
 
51
35
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
Under 3 Years
Atlanta, GA
Shot in the dark…. Did you run some sessions with traction control and/or AdvanceTrak engaged? Heavy rear pad wear could be from those systems applying lots of rear brake.
Yes I also read here that traction control is the main culprit along with heat buildup causing the inner rear to wear much faster than the outer (regardless, both are done lol)

as I began this HPDE hobby in March 2022, i ran about 5 days in Sports mode (TC fully on since I didnt touch toggle), then another 5 days in Track Mode (which turns TC partially off automatically as I read here, i also did not touch toggle)


So my idea was to turn TC off (#3 listed below) for next event

not sure if I’ve mistaken, but by my understanding there’s multiple stages to turning TC/Stability off
1. TC on by default (nothing touched)
2. TC partially off (toggle not touched, automatically turned partially off when Track Mode engaged)
3. TC fully off (toggled once while in Track Mode)
4. Full Advanced Trac(Stability Control) Off (Holding toggle for 8 seconds)

i do not want to do #4 since I want Stability Control, so I was thinking to go with #3, which will turn traction OFF, but keep Stability ON


Please feel free to correct me with any misinformation above!
 
51
35
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
Under 3 Years
Atlanta, GA
blvckgt -----a Carbotech 10 is more like a G-Loc 8 and I found on my Boss S that the rears went much quicker than the fronts when I was on 8s, so I moved up to 10s. So with the Carbotechs you probably might want to use 12s in the rear and see how that works? The other item I would ask is what were you using up front? This may not be the answer in your case , but I did find they rears wearing quicker than I expected when I had run G-Loc 8s.
I’m currently using XP12 front and XP10 rear
Feels balanced and quite happy with them other than the quick rear wear

But my brake pads are discolored (white residue which I assume reached near peak temperature?). This indicates I definitely need to upgrade to a higher grade, right?


Also, if I upgrade my rear to XP12, to what I need to upgrade my fronts: XP20/XP12, or is XP24/12 too extreme?

I’m running 200tw tires at Road Atlanta.
I haven't felt significant brake fade with xp12/xp10 during my usage this full year (spring, summer, fall), or to be honest maybe I haven’t noticed because I’m still a novice driver 🤦🏻‍♂️

But I did cut my laptime from 1:53 to 1:39 at Road Atlanta all on the same pad, so overall good idea to bump up a tier
 

Bill Pemberton

0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
7,000
6,142
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Blair, Nebraska
That is a tremendous jump in time and with speed comes .................faster wear, ha! The 24 is their endurance pad and it might be good for RA as you have some very fast areas and slowing down our heavy cars will wear pads out. You might upgrade the fronts to 16 or 20s and then go to 12s in the back, but do keep in mind that you will use pads up quicker , regardless of brand as you go quicker. 1:39 is quite decent for a newcomer, so congrats, and do make sure with Carbotechs or G-Locs to always buy pre-bedded pads. Do always clean your rotors when installing new pads and hopefully you are changing your Brake Fluid ( DOT 4 always ) quite frequently --- especially running fast road courses. I believe in changing it after every weekend , but then I heat up everything to the max on almost any track. I definitely don't recommend going more than two track weekends without changing your fluid -- Motul 600 is a good choice for example.
 
28
19
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Charlotte
Yes I also read here that traction control is the main culprit along with heat buildup causing the inner rear to wear much faster than the outer (regardless, both are done lol)

as I began this HPDE hobby in March 2022, i ran about 5 days in Sports mode (TC fully on since I didnt touch toggle), then another 5 days in Track Mode (which turns TC partially off automatically as I read here, i also did not touch toggle)


So my idea was to turn TC off (#3 listed below) for next event

not sure if I’ve mistaken, but by my understanding there’s multiple stages to turning TC/Stability off
1. TC on by default (nothing touched)
2. TC partially off (toggle not touched, automatically turned partially off when Track Mode engaged)
3. TC fully off (toggled once while in Track Mode)
4. Full Advanced Trac(Stability Control) Off (Holding toggle for 8 seconds)

i do not want to do #4 since I want Stability Control, so I was thinking to go with #3, which will turn traction OFF, but keep Stability ON


Please feel free to correct me with any misinformation above!

Your info is correct. And your thought process/progression is also sound. Especially as you carry more speed and approach the limits (tires, brakes, skills etc) it important to make small changes. Remember this each time you disable a level of the driver-aid systems. To many people, it can be eye opening how much the systems were engaging. You don’t want to find that out the hard way at Road Atlanta. Baby steps.
 
I’m currently using XP12 front and XP10 rear
Feels balanced and quite happy with them other than the quick rear wear

But my brake pads are discolored (white residue which I assume reached near peak temperature?). This indicates I definitely need to upgrade to a higher grade, right?


Also, if I upgrade my rear to XP12, to what I need to upgrade my fronts: XP20/XP12, or is XP24/12 too extreme?

I’m running 200tw tires at Road Atlanta.
I haven't felt significant brake fade with xp12/xp10 during my usage this full year (spring, summer, fall), or to be honest maybe I haven’t noticed because I’m still a novice driver 🤦🏻‍♂️

But I did cut my laptime from 1:53 to 1:39 at Road Atlanta all on the same pad, so overall good idea to bump up a tier
White residue is the paint burning off the plates and sides of the compounds. Visually you can not tell any difference between compounds, so the paint is used to track compounds.
 
51
35
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
Under 3 Years
Atlanta, GA
That is a tremendous jump in time and with speed comes .................faster wear, ha! The 24 is their endurance pad and it might be good for RA as you have some very fast areas and slowing down our heavy cars will wear pads out. You might upgrade the fronts to 16 or 20s and then go to 12s in the back, but do keep in mind that you will use pads up quicker , regardless of brand as you go quicker. 1:39 is quite decent for a newcomer, so congrats, and do make sure with Carbotechs or G-Locs to always buy pre-bedded pads. Do always clean your rotors when installing new pads and hopefully you are changing your Brake Fluid ( DOT 4 always ) quite frequently --- especially running fast road courses. I believe in changing it after every weekend , but then I heat up everything to the max on almost any track. I definitely don't recommend going more than two track weekends without changing your fluid -- Motul 600 is a good choice for example.

Yes, yes, and yes! haha As fun this hobby is, my wallet is crying 😂

So XP24 being an 'Endurance' compound, does the XP24 compound last particularly longer than XP20?
From what I understand XP24 last longer and bites harder than XP20
Being only 20 bucks difference, in what cases would I go for XP20 over the XP24?
Would it be too big of a jump going from XP12 to XP24 in the front? Would going to XP20 be a safer choice?
I'll be going to the track once a month, 8 Road Atlantas, 1 Barber, and 1 VIR planned for 2023 so far.

Seems like I'm set on XP12 rear, but just wanted to make sure to cover potential oversight I might be failing to see for the XP24 vs XP20 front.

Thanks @Bill Pemberton @Egparson202 @OPMustang Tim for the great advice and information
I really appreciate your help and inputs!
 

Bill Pemberton

0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
7,000
6,142
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Blair, Nebraska
XP24 and the corresponding R18 G-Locs both seem to last a bit longer, but they will squeal like a pig in heat! One note, I am hard on brake pads though I have had good luck with the new EBC ones I have been using, so I went with the R18s ( and previously XP24s ) because I will get the brake pads quite hot and I like the temp those both with take. I have had friends find 16 or 20s work fine for them, but what we all need to understand when discussing pads is that one's style of braking can vary a lot between drivers ( and the tracks they run). I have not liked pads with high initial bite and both Carbo and G-Loc are more mainstream and some folks even find the pedal feels a little softer than over some pads they gave used previously. I like the linear feel and that has been beneficial to me as they are easier to trail brake in my estimation. Yet, using the SR11 EBC pads of late their initial bite is insane and will throw you through the windshield. I had to relearn with them, though they lessened a little after one session, but the bite is still there and they seem easy on my rotors. I did not like Hawks in the past as their initial bite is strong, but they seem to eat my rotors for breakfast, lunch and dinner.
 
486
428
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Lenoir City TN
Could I ask what difference you felt running R16/R10 vs R16/R12?
My (Carbotech equivalent) rear pads wore out so much faster than my fronts, so I'm investigating the forum to see if I need to bump it up from 10 to 12, or if that'll even have any effect on it lol
I can't really tell much difference. The R12's have a little more initial bite and wear a little faster for me. The R10's wear like iron. I went through 2-3 sets of front pads for each set of rears when running the 4 piston Brembo set up with traction control off. Like others have said, traction control can eat rear brakes. If I run traction control on, I go through a couple sets of rears to each set of fronts. I switched to 6 piston calipers this year, but haven't been able to run much first due to transmission issues and now due to someone plowing into me on track a couple of weeks ago. I am probably done until spring due to body shop schedules. I may be able to go back to R12's on front with the greater pad surface area.
 
28
19
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Charlotte
Yes, yes, and yes! haha As fun this hobby is, my wallet is crying 😂

So XP24 being an 'Endurance' compound, does the XP24 compound last particularly longer than XP20?
From what I understand XP24 last longer and bites harder than XP20
Being only 20 bucks difference, in what cases would I go for XP20 over the XP24?
Would it be too big of a jump going from XP12 to XP24 in the front? Would going to XP20 be a safer choice?
I'll be going to the track once a month, 8 Road Atlantas, 1 Barber, and 1 VIR planned for 2023 so far.

Seems like I'm set on XP12 rear, but just wanted to make sure to cover potential oversight I might be failing to see for the XP24 vs XP20 front.

Thanks @Bill Pemberton @Egparson202 @OPMustang Tim for the great advice and information
I really appreciate your help and inputs!

One more thing to consider… it’s definitely possible to overwhelm the tires with really aggressive pad compounds. I think I saw that you’re using 200TW tires. Sneak up on it or move to stickier tires.
 
486
428
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Lenoir City TN
Borrowed from Vorschlag website:

Compound Comparison Chart (“secret decoder ring” )
CT…..G-LOC
1521 = GS-1 ….. This is the “street” pad that works great for daily driving
AX6 = R6 ……… This is the Autocross pad compound, more aggressive yet works well cold
XP8 = R8 ……… This is the first of many Road Course compounds
XP10 = R10 …… This is the first of many Road Course compounds
XP12 = R12 ……. This is the first of many Road Course compounds
RP2 = R14 ……… This is a fairly aggressive compound ideal for Endurance Racing
XP20 = R16 ……. This is a very aggressive compound ideal for Competition use
XP24 = R18 ……. This is their most aggressive compound ideal, and is suited for Competition use

It is a few years old, so compounds may have changed some.
 
229
258
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
20+ Years
NC
As Bill said, pad compound may be more of a preference type thing. I run R18/R12 on my Bullitt. The fronts wear like iron and stop the heavy beast over and over; most of the time with little if any fade. Also run Motul RBF600 brake fluid. As Mr. Parson stated, the faster you go, the more you will use up brakes.
 
242
201
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
Under 3 Years
MD
As Bill said, pad compound may be more of a preference type thing. I run R18/R12 on my Bullitt. The fronts wear like iron and stop the heavy beast over and over; most of the time with little if any fade. Also run Motul RBF600 brake fluid. As Mr. Parson stated, the faster you go, the more you will use up brakes.
On which tires?
 

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