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S197 2011 Mustang 3.7 Performance Package, Shooting my shot at CAM-C Build Thread Profile - S197 Mustangs

DaveW

TMO Intermediate
59
83
St. Louis
I've heard the Falkens run wide for their size but holy smokes those 315s are meaty! Any comparison shots to the Rivals, Yokos, or stones?
Photo attached with 315 Falken next to 335 BFG, both on 18x12 wheels. A Yokohama 315 on the same wheel is about halfway between these two width wise.



Have guys down the road from me ( Lincoln, Nebraska ) who are good Autocross Friends and they all say the 660 Falkens are a big improvement over the 615, but they are not as quick as the Rival S 1.5, Yokohama A052, or Bridgestone RE71R. Considering that two of these guys are National Champions, the site they and I run is the SCCA Solo Nationals site, that is a fairly credible comparison. But, they also feel the logical next step , since they don't get hot quite as quick as the others, they could be better on a road course? In my experience , talking to racing buddies from around the Country and from some info from Luke Pavlik ( track rat and autocrosser ) at Tire Rack ( ext. #4362 ), there may be some chance this is the case. The A052 is super fast, so is the RE71 and the Rival S 1.5, and the 660 is almost super fast, when viewed in an autocross, but taking in friend's thoughts and listening to Luke, the BFG seems to take longer to get greasy on a road course than the Yoke or B-stones. The Falken seems to be similar ( to the BFGs ) in taking longer to get greasy with guys I know , but the caveat is they are all driving smaller cars.

Hope to hear from our Falken TMO member , but if you go with a 200 TWR tire , I would lean towards the Falken or a BFG Rival 1.5 S. DaveW ( soloperformance.com ) has run BFGs, B-Stones and Yokes on his CAM-C Mustang and not sure if he has hit any road courses, but he might add some thoughts, especially since he is the Clairvoyant that knew the 315 Falkens were already out!!!

Keep in mind, tires that are great on one car may not be advantageous on others ( due to hp, torque, weight, suspensioning, etc. ) and that is part of the reason the more info you get the more you will feel comfortable in your choice. Lastly , driving style also can affect your choice , since some drivers destroy tires rapidly , whereas others seem to get max life out of their rubber donuts, and this is not just an indication of speed or talent. I know some super quick drivers who get one weekend out of a set of Hoosiers, and other speed demons who get 3 weekends and are still as quick - radically different driving style?!

Lastly, listen, listen, listen to others with alot of experience , even if you happen to have extensive track time/autocross time , yourself. Good example was a discussion I had with DaveW of SoloPerformance.com ( and a TMO member above ) awhile back concerning the A052 and the BFG Rival S 1.5s. He mentioned with two drivers the A052s just got too hot during an Autocross event , and he would be switching back to the BFGs. The Yoke might be the ticket for a Miata , but the weight and torque of the Mustang might mean it was not the choice for the bigger car. Another example is the 2nd Place car in B Street at the Nationals, last year , was a Mustang GT 350 on Rivals. The winner was a Tesla, but it was moved subsequently to a faster Class in 2020. The Rivals seem to be a top choice for the CAM-C cars also, as weight and torque/hp determine alot on how quickly a tire gets hot, or too hot.

Lots of ideas from the rambling mind of the Old F.A.R.T. in Nebraska, but I am sure others will chime in and the wonderful thing about TMO is there is a wealth of experience on here ,all willing to assist and help others.

PS - Merry Christmas , everyone!!!
And yet, other fast guys, one who works for Bridgestone, says the RT660 is at least equal to the other top tier tires, if not better. At least on big cars.

No one knows yet, of course. If you look at the Dixie Winter tour results, the 93/193 car was on Falkens and I was (#39) on Saturday. It was VERY cold on Saturday (41 degrees at start and windy) and they were better than BFG would have been in those conditions, but I seriously needed a codriver to make them work. The forecast on Sunday was for similar temps and cloudy, so I switched to my Michelin PS4's and of course it started 5 degrees warmer and got warmer much quicker making it too hot for those. Oh well, I think I improved at least one spot.

Initial impression on the Falken is good, but I need more time, in warmer weather and a chance to play with setup more to see how good. They are not world beaters, but also not slow. They have much better steering response and feedback than BFG or Yokohama, but not RE71 level. Of course, RE71 is discontinued, so it really isn't part of a discussion anyway.

And like you said, it depends on driver, and also event site - Lincoln has some odd properties that other concrete sites don't seem to have. Peru concrete loves the Goodyear SC3 for autocross, but it is not nearly as good elsewhere.

Lots of variables.

DaveW

126053901_10225013270704850_4229439297460281699_o.jpg
 

Bill Pemberton

0ld Ford Automotive Racing Terror
5,023
3,412
Blair, Nebraska
W2W Racing
20+ Years
.....and there you go folks, DaveW of Solo Performance Specialties comes through. I have known his family for over 30 years and they have a history in Autocrossing that goes back to the last Century , ha. Dave supplies racing equipment and other expertise at a lot of the SCCA Autocrosses as well as some NASA road race events, so since I run both, glad to have him contributing on TMO.
 

drj2k1

TMO Intermediate
71
61
Bayside, NY
Photo attached with 315 Falken next to 335 BFG, both on 18x12 wheels. A Yokohama 315 on the same wheel is about halfway between these two width wise.





And yet, other fast guys, one who works for Bridgestone, says the RT660 is at least equal to the other top tier tires, if not better. At least on big cars.

No one knows yet, of course. If you look at the Dixie Winter tour results, the 93/193 car was on Falkens and I was (#39) on Saturday. It was VERY cold on Saturday (41 degrees at start and windy) and they were better than BFG would have been in those conditions, but I seriously needed a codriver to make them work. The forecast on Sunday was for similar temps and cloudy, so I switched to my Michelin PS4's and of course it started 5 degrees warmer and got warmer much quicker making it too hot for those. Oh well, I think I improved at least one spot.

Initial impression on the Falken is good, but I need more time, in warmer weather and a chance to play with setup more to see how good. They are not world beaters, but also not slow. They have much better steering response and feedback than BFG or Yokohama, but not RE71 level. Of course, RE71 is discontinued, so it really isn't part of a discussion anyway.

And like you said, it depends on driver, and also event site - Lincoln has some odd properties that other concrete sites don't seem to have. Peru concrete loves the Goodyear SC3 for autocross, but it is not nearly as good elsewhere.

Lots of variables.

DaveW

View attachment 60527

This is why I love this forum!

Thanks Dave for the synopsis of the autocross tire game for end of 2020 into 2021. It's been harder and harder to find reputable information, let alone first hand experience from a S197 autocrosser. Seems like the RT660 might be a good fit for co-driven CAM-C next year with the heavier cars, higher heat tolerance, and the fact that they run "wide" for their size. Looks like they've got quite a few sizes in the pipeline after speaking with Discount Tire Direct (Tirerack still has a limited selection listed at this time).

Looking forward to hearing more of your insights and feedback as the season progresses
 

drj2k1

TMO Intermediate
71
61
Bayside, NY
Small mid winter update:

Progress made on the the junkyard Brembo rebuild. Had a new crossover tube fabricated at a local shop, its not as pretty or tight fitting as OE but I'm hoping it'll do (have to check clearance with the 18's). The rest of the rebuild was straightforward with OP Mustang sourced bits. Unfortunately catastrophe hit during the bleeder replacement with both inner salt crusted bleeders snapping. I've had bleeders break on Subaru's, but these were particularly fubbared despite being doused in Kroil. of course to continue this comedy of errors, the EZ out broke in one😑. Wondering if the PO seriously cranked them down... Oh well.. will be having a friend shop try to save them with the drill/tap before making any tougher decisions
IMG_7242.jpegIMG_7241.jpegIMG_7245.jpeg

On a positive note and continuing the trend of "parts bin special", scored some sweet parts for the budget autocross diff upgrade from the Cortex garage sale. BNIB set of carbon clutch discs and a lightly used 13-14 Track Pack finned rear diff cover. A local autocrosser who runs a wicked patina'd 63 Falcon will be rebuilding the 8.8 Trac-Lok and seems to know how to pack discs to make pretty tight. Out of curiosity, anyone on TMO got any secrets for stacking the clutches/packing on the ol Trac-Lok?
IMG_7254.jpeg
Got a long way to go before the 2021 season commences in March
 

Dave_W

Cones - not just for ice cream
138
123
Connecticut
Autocross
20+ Years

Sjohnson1800

TMO Intermediate
79
53
Wisconsin
Small mid winter update:

Progress made on the the junkyard Brembo rebuild. Had a new crossover tube fabricated at a local shop, its not as pretty or tight fitting as OE but I'm hoping it'll do (have to check clearance with the 18's). The rest of the rebuild was straightforward with OP Mustang sourced bits. Unfortunately catastrophe hit during the bleeder replacement with both inner salt crusted bleeders snapping. I've had bleeders break on Subaru's, but these were particularly fubbared despite being doused in Kroil. of course to continue this comedy of errors, the EZ out broke in one😑. Wondering if the PO seriously cranked them down... Oh well.. will be having a friend shop try to save them with the drill/tap before making any tougher decisions
View attachment 61088View attachment 61087View attachment 61089

On a positive note and continuing the trend of "parts bin special", scored some sweet parts for the budget autocross diff upgrade from the Cortex garage sale. BNIB set of carbon clutch discs and a lightly used 13-14 Track Pack finned rear diff cover. A local autocrosser who runs a wicked patina'd 63 Falcon will be rebuilding the 8.8 Trac-Lok and seems to know how to pack discs to make pretty tight. Out of curiosity, anyone on TMO got any secrets for stacking the clutches/packing on the ol Trac-Lok?
View attachment 61086
Got a long way to go before the 2021 season commences in March
if you don’t mind me asking where did you pick up the diff cover?? I’ve been looking and it seems like most places are around $200 just wondering u got a better deal.
thanks
 

drj2k1

TMO Intermediate
71
61
Bayside, NY
if you don’t mind me asking where did you pick up the diff cover?? I’ve been looking and it seems like most places are around $200 just wondering u got a better deal.
thanks
Hey, I happened to get lucky and stumbled across the garage sale section of Cortex Racing. Looks like they have 1-2 left back in stock but you'll have to confirm with Filip. Check them out here: https://cortexracing.com/shop/garage-sale/

J
 

gwilliams38

TMO Intermediate
28
18
New Fairfield, CT
Autocross
Under 3 Years
Small mid winter update:

Progress made on the the junkyard Brembo rebuild. Had a new crossover tube fabricated at a local shop, its not as pretty or tight fitting as OE but I'm hoping it'll do (have to check clearance with the 18's). The rest of the rebuild was straightforward with OP Mustang sourced bits. Unfortunately catastrophe hit during the bleeder replacement with both inner salt crusted bleeders snapping. I've had bleeders break on Subaru's, but these were particularly fubbared despite being doused in Kroil. of course to continue this comedy of errors, the EZ out broke in one😑. Wondering if the PO seriously cranked them down... Oh well.. will be having a friend shop try to save them with the drill/tap before making any tougher decisions
View attachment 61088View attachment 61087View attachment 61089

On a positive note and continuing the trend of "parts bin special", scored some sweet parts for the budget autocross diff upgrade from the Cortex garage sale. BNIB set of carbon clutch discs and a lightly used 13-14 Track Pack finned rear diff cover. A local autocrosser who runs a wicked patina'd 63 Falcon will be rebuilding the 8.8 Trac-Lok and seems to know how to pack discs to make pretty tight. Out of curiosity, anyone on TMO got any secrets for stacking the clutches/packing on the ol Trac-Lok?
View attachment 61086
Got a long way to go before the 2021 season commences in March
People who don't know Kroil need to know kroil. The wonderdrug.
 

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