Carbon Ceramic Brakes - They're on!

Discussion in 'Brakes, Wheels and Tires' started by JAJ, Jun 18, 2017.

  1. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    I'm an early adopter once in a while, and I liked the look of the CCB brakes on cars around me, so I figured I'd give the RacingBrake kit a try. Customer service was excellent, and the 4 to 6 week delivery was just under 5 weeks. So, today, I put them on.

    20170618_115808-small.jpg

    Reading about how light they are doesn't prepare you for how light they are! It's shocking when you pick one up the first time.

    Same scale, same time, OEM:

    20170618_121630-small.jpg

    When I ordered them, I had a choice of three brake pads: Street, Sport (Corvette ZR1 OEM) and a sintered race pad. After doing enough research on CCB pads to get thoroughly confused, I decided to order with the street pads. I already had a brand-new set of Pagid RS29's on the shelf, and according to the experts, they're suitable for use with CCB rotors. I figured they'd be my track pads and the street pads would be good for just running around. For a comparison, here are three different pads - the RS29's, the Racing Brake street pads, and a new OEM GT350. Yes, that's a titanium insert on the left.

    20170618_125447_small.jpg

    So, what does it look like when it's done (after about 1/2 hour per side, plus a half hour to clean the rims so I can tell if the dusting is less). Voila!

    20170618_123355-small.jpg
     
  2. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    I'll do another post when I've had a chance to take them for a drive - it's pouring out and I didn't see the point in reviewing new brake components after a drive in the rain, so it'll probably be tomorrow for the "what're they like to drive with" post.

    Something I didn't put in the first post is that RB tells me they have a sintered street pad coming (in about 4 to 6 weeks) that'll be good for street and sport, but probably not full-on track duty. Sintered pads are good because they don't need bedding, they don't fade and they wear very slowly. I'll probably get a set to try once they're out.
     
    Tob and VoodooBoss like this.
  3. Tob

    Tob TMO Race

    Messages:
    200
    Likes Received:
    58
    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2011
    Location:
    Upstate
    The weight reduction - wow. How many internal organs/body parts did you have to forego? These were silly expensive last time I looked.

    Regardless, kudos to you as those rotors are gorgeous and one of the few ways to potentially make this braking system even better. Looking forward to your experience with them.
     
  4. VoodooBoss

    VoodooBoss Rick Moderator

    Messages:
    20,166
    Likes Received:
    2,593
    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2010
    Location:
    90 Miles East of Sonoma Raceway
    In for performance updates.
     
  5. mattlqx

    mattlqx Mustangless

    Messages:
    448
    Likes Received:
    200
    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Location:
    Chandler, AZ
    Hmmmmmmm. Last I heard any kind of street driving rather destroys ceramic rotors because of the high operating temperatures required. I'd only really be interested for track driving anyway, but I'm interested to see how these hold up for you on the street.
     
  6. VoodooBoss

    VoodooBoss Rick Moderator

    Messages:
    20,166
    Likes Received:
    2,593
    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2010
    Location:
    90 Miles East of Sonoma Raceway
    I have a friend who's the original owner of a 2008 Ferrari F430 F1 with 10,000 miles on it including a few track days. The CCB's have never been touched and he's had no issues with the brakes. Now the F1 trans is a whole different story.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2017
  7. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    I got out to do some driving with the new brakes today on dry roads. Nothing like a track environment, but more info just the same. Keep in mind I'm on the RB STREET compound, not a sport compound.

    - Quiet? Check. Good modulation? Check. Engages ABS if you push? Check. Dust? Nothing visible in the first ten miles. The feel reminds me of Carbotech 1521 street compound - easy to drive, no drama. Less bite than the OEM Ferodo's, but competent just the same.

    - Ride quality - it's like driving a whole different car. It's amazing what taking 16.4 pounds off of each front wheel does for the way the car rides. It's hard to explain - like trying to explain why an MGW shifter is better than stock.
     
    VoodooBoss likes this.
  8. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    Did you mean "track driving"? CCB rotors have to stay below 700 degrees C or 1300 degrees F or they will start to lose mass. If you keep the temperature down, they will last a long time. I'm planning to run a stripe of rotor temp paint on mine the first time out to see just how hot they get.
     
  9. mattlqx

    mattlqx Mustangless

    Messages:
    448
    Likes Received:
    200
    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Location:
    Chandler, AZ
    No, I had read somewhere that they wore quicker when not up to high temperatures (not just that pedal feel was different when not at those temps). I can't find a source though now that I search, so maybe it was wrong or I misunderstood.
     
  10. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    Ahh... I didn't run into that in my research, but it's certainly possible that it's true, or that it was true on an earlier generation of CCB's. Depending on how you count them, we're on the third or fourth generation now, and they're continuing to evolve.

    The thing with these current generation rotors is that they don't actually wear. They have a super-hard surface layer that the pad slides on, so worn out rotors are the same thickness as new ones. Instead of wearing, they age when heat causes the carbon fiber in the ceramic body of the rotor to oxidize, turning it to carbon dioxide (CO2) that floats away. They get lighter and lighter until they're no longer usable. Supposedly, they will outlast iron rotors about 4:1 if you don't overheat them.
     
    trackjunkie likes this.
  11. TMSBOSS

    TMSBOSS TMO Addict

    Messages:
    3,799
    Likes Received:
    1,016
    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2011
    Location:
    Illinois
    If you don't overheat them. I guess that would not work for me. :rolleyes:

    Anxious to hear about your track experiences with these rotors.
     
  12. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    I ordered the rotor temperature paint today - 600, 650, 700 and 750 degree ratings. We'll see which one changes when I get to the track. It'll be July - I just don't know yet which date will work.
     
  13. El_Jefe_302

    El_Jefe_302 TMO Intermediate

    Messages:
    33
    Likes Received:
    7
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2014
    Wow! 30 lbs for the OEM rotors. I would think they would be lighter being a two piece design. Saving about 32 lbs of unsprung weight. Gonna handle and brake even better!
     
    VoodooBoss likes this.
  14. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    The weight saving is a big deal - the car feels completely different with just these rotors changed. I can't stop thinking about the way it would be if you put 350R CF rims and MPSC2's on as well. The stock GT350 front hub has a 30# rotor, a 30# wheel and a 30# tire on it for a total of 90#. With these and the GT350R front tire and wheel, you have a 14# rotor, an 18# wheel and a 26# tire - total weight is 58#, a reduction of 32# from stock. That'll leave a mark!
     
  15. TymeSlayer

    TymeSlayer Tramps like us, Baby we were born to run...

    Messages:
    2,451
    Likes Received:
    1,169
    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2011
    Location:
    Brighton, Colorado
    No one informed me that sitting down would be a requirement when looking at the cost of these rotors and I bedded my ass on the ground.
     
  16. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    It hadn't occurred to me that there would be a risk of spinal cord injury!

    So, the logic (there is some) goes like this: If you have a GT350 and you take off one 60 pound front wheel/tire combo and replace it with a 44 pound GT350R front CF wheel/MPSC2 tire combo, you reduce the unsprung weight by 16 pounds. Buying new CF rims and PSC2 tires for the front axle costs about $6k or so, and of course you'd really need all four corners, so maybe $10k to $12k by the time you're done. The magic of the CCB front rotors is that they also reduce the front axle weight by 16 pounds a side and they cost about the same as the CF front rim/tire combo. However, with the rotor swap, you don't need new rear rims, and the weight reduction stays on the car when the wheels come off. The front axle always weighs 16 pounds less, regardless which wheels and tires are installed.

    In other words, they're more expensive than iron rotors, but they're a lot cheaper than a set of CF rims!
     
    JediRocker, RaiderJatt02 and WRB like this.
  17. TMSBOSS

    TMSBOSS TMO Addict

    Messages:
    3,799
    Likes Received:
    1,016
    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2011
    Location:
    Illinois
    Now that's car guy logic I can get behind!!!
    Similar to the discussion I had with my wife....where I explained the cost of rebuilding the motor in the Boss is her fault. Now stay with me on this. I may need a place to sleep soon. Boss motors have let go on track, its just a fact. Many before 5K in track miles. Had my wife allowed me to run 5K plus in track miles before the warranty ran out, Ford buys the motor. See, perfect car guy logic. And for those of you wondering, I'm still with my first wife. And yes, she does let me get away with saying these things.....but only once. Got to love that woman!!
     
  18. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    More car-guy logic - here's my theory on fuel economy: buying two cars cuts your fuel consumption in half because you can only drive one at a time!
     
    Grant 302, 2012Boss302 and VoodooBoss like this.
  19. JAJ

    JAJ TMO Race

    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    404
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2016
    I've got about 120 miles on the new brakes. Front rims are still clean, although you see a faint tan colored dust mark on your finger if you wipe them. It's equivalent to about 100 yards on the stock brakes.
     
    VoodooBoss likes this.
  20. VoodooBoss

    VoodooBoss Rick Moderator

    Messages:
    20,166
    Likes Received:
    2,593
    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2010
    Location:
    90 Miles East of Sonoma Raceway
    LMAO we think alike!
     

Share This Page