Don't think I'm ready for stickies yet

[Egparson202]

Sorry I haven't responded to this one in a while.

I never really feel a sense of not being able to turn the car enough. In fact, turn in feels pretty damn good. It's just when I get settled in to these sweepers that it feels like the car starts developing understeer. The only things that seem to help when I'm at this point is either lifting or inducing oversteer. I guess taping the brakes works too, but I haven't done that since my first two trips to the track. I guess it's just in my head to not brake in the middle of the turn Or after the apex.

I feel like this is mostly a weight transfer issue and not my line. I just need to be better at setting the car up for these long turns. I think the car should be able to handle the speeds I'm trying to get through these turns, but maybe I'm wrong.

Currently I have the steeda dual rate springs and standard front bar (I think 35 or 36mm) and compition rear.
Endlinks are set at second from front on the front and middle in the rear.

I don’t know the track so my input here is limited. Maybe a good idea to compare your experience (data if you have it) to a known fast driver/car. It’s quite possible you’re doing it all right. The track may just kill tires.

 

[KJNVUDU]

Not a bad idea. I've got a garmin catalyst that I think I can compare with others. I've just been a little ashamed of broadcasting my poor performance! Lol!!
Time to swallow the pride and put it out there. I don't care, if it makes me a better driver!

 

[TMSBOSS]

Exactly. Everyone here sucked when they started. Some of us still suck

Share your data and there is a good chance another member may have data to compare.

 

[Bill Pemberton]

For years I have suggested discussions of the tracks one is planning to run, because no matter what one individual may say about a specific tire's wear, the track can be critical in its life. Prior to MPH ( Hastings, Ne. ) being repaved it was not uncommon to go through a set of tires or destroy one or two for aggressive drivers. Yet one could go to Topeka ( Heartland Motorsports Park ) and those same tires would wear for 4-5 weekends. Hastings was repaved ( typical for 15 year old tracks ) and it is easy on tires now. I have never run NOLA, but I have quite a few friends who run there and like TMS noted , it is a Cajun Alligator that devours rubber.
If this is the track you plan to attend the most, an endurance type 200 TWR tire could be a good choice ( Continental Extreme Force, RS-4, Goodyear Supercar F1 3 , etc. ). Enjoy and you might even consider a set of used Michelin or Pirelli slicks, since they will be cheaper if the alligator keeps chewing, and one other option may be the rock hard , slow Toyo RR slicks, that is a Spec Tire for various NASA Classes and they wear forever. Just a thought and you can get a discount if you purchase through Trackdaytire. You have choices and do ask your friends about the tracks you plan to run, as you may find some are not only fun, they may be easier on the budget.

 

[KJNVUDU]

I think short term going forward that will be the plan (200twr) for me. At least for Nola. I went back last Thursday for an scca track night and put the Bridgestones back on. I drove the car down and wanted to have some tire left to make it back home. Plus the real reason I think, was I wanted to see how much of the 6 second drop from previous otd was the cup2s.
I was 2.5 seconds faster than last time on Bridgestones.
And man was that car squirming around compared to the michelins! But I gotta say I enjoyed the hell out of it feeling like I was on the edge of adhesion the whole time!!

I would love to find a good source for used slicks, but until I can drop down to 18s, I think that will be a challenge. I have seen a lot of people suggesting the Goodyear f1s and might try them for my next new set. I can't explain why, but I really liked the 315 size of the cups so maybe the Falken rt660 should make it on the short list.

I will definitely start making it to different tracks, but as I've said elsewhere, I was born in the wrong damn part of the country and have been too stupid/comfortable to move. Although with the hotter it keeps getting around here, it may one day happen!
I've been working just west of Charlotte here recently and when I began to realize the number of tracks within a few hours drive, I became sold on the idea of buying a house up there somewhere.
The next two closest tracks for me would be Barber and Houston. Both around 5 hours away.

 

[blacksheep-1]

I think short term going forward that will be the plan (200twr) for me. At least for Nola. I went back last Thursday for an scca track night and put the Bridgestones back on. I drove the car down and wanted to have some tire left to make it back home. Plus the real reason I think, was I wanted to see how much of the 6 second drop from previous otd was the cup2s.
I was 2.5 seconds faster than last time on Bridgestones.
And man was that car squirming around compared to the michelins! But I gotta say I enjoyed the hell out of it feeling like I was on the edge of adhesion the whole time!!

I would love to find a good source for used slicks, but until I can drop down to 18s, I think that will be a challenge. I have seen a lot of people suggesting the Goodyear f1s and might try them for my next new set. I can't explain why, but I really liked the 315 size of the cups so maybe the Falken rt660 should make it on the short list.

I will definitely start making it to different tracks, but as I've said elsewhere, I was born in the wrong damn part of the country and have been too stupid/comfortable to move. Although with the hotter it keeps getting around here, it may one day happen!
I've been working just west of Charlotte here recently and when I began to realize the number of tracks within a few hours drive, I became sold on the idea of buying a house up there somewhere.
The next two closest tracks for me would be Barber and Houston. Both around 5 hours away.

Kohr has so many used slicks that I'm not allowed to bring any backnow. So we've been disposing of them at the track.. which is painful for me because being a lo buck guy at heart, I know somebody could use them. Phoenix also has a warehouse full of Hossiers, especially after the runoffs.
The thing is, are you racing in competition or just doing HPDE?
If you are just doing HPDE then find some 200TDW tires and go have fun. HPDE can be the biggest pecker measuring contest there is, I've seen guys dump tons of money into cars just for bragging rights, but you get those same drivers into class racing and they suck, their speed is all in their wallet.

 

[blacksheep-1]

For years I have suggested discussions of the tracks one is planning to run, because no matter what one individual may say about a specific tire's wear, the track can be critical in its life. Prior to MPH ( Hastings, Ne. ) being repaved it was not uncommon to go through a set of tires or destroy one or two for aggressive drivers. Yet one could go to Topeka ( Heartland Motorsports Park ) and those same tires would wear for 4-5 weekends. Hastings was repaved ( typical for 15 year old tracks ) and it is easy on tires now. I have never run NOLA, but I have quite a few friends who run there and like TMS noted , it is a Cajun Alligator that devours rubber.
If this is the track you plan to attend the most, an endurance type 200 TWR tire could be a good choice ( Continental Extreme Force, RS-4, Goodyear Supercar F1 3 , etc. ). Enjoy and you might even consider a set of used Michelin or Pirelli slicks, since they will be cheaper if the alligator keeps chewing, and one other option may be the rock hard , slow Toyo RR slicks, that is a Spec Tire for various NASA Classes and they wear forever. Just a thought and you can get a discount if you purchase through Trackdaytire. You have choices and do ask your friends about the tracks you plan to run, as you may find some are not only fun, they may be easier on the budget.

Generally the saying "old track, new tires, new track, old tires" is justified. Anywhere we ran in IMSA with new pavement, we always ran scuffs for the long segments, combine that with having to run the qualifying tires to start, it means we usually run scuffs of some kind for the whole race. We keep a set of stickers on the rack in case of a late race splash and go, we can change one side for the charge to the end. But that saying is pretty much gold. It was Bruce Foss the director of all north american road course racing for Continental, that let me in on that.
HPDE is a bit different in that it is not nearly as intense, but I would just run some 200TDW stuff. Those alligator tracks might eat up those slicks as well.

 

[stevbd]

The thing is, are you racing in competition or just doing HPDE?
If you are just doing HPDE then find some 200TDW tires and go have fun. HPDE can be the biggest pecker measuring contest there is, I've seen guys dump tons of money into cars just for bragging rights, but you get those same drivers into class racing and they suck, their speed is all in their wallet.

I hear you but just because people are racing for some cheap trophy and maybe a little prize money doesn't necessarily make it more meaningful. Whether it's DE, time trials, auto-x, or W2W racing it's all pretty much just spending money for fun. More money, more fun. Bragging rights and purchased speed are always part of the game. Is there a race team on the planet that turns a profit? As they say if someone passes you they are either better or richer or maybe both.... I think that applies to pretty much all levels and types of track driving. I'm just an HPDE hack but if I could afford it I would absolutely get a GT3 RS or whatever, put some slicks on it and trailer it around in my luxury man cave trailer and I wouldn't apologize to anyone, lol.

 

[TMSBOSS]

Kohr has so many used slicks that I'm not allowed to bring any backnow. So we've been disposing of them at the track.. which is painful for me because being a lo buck guy at heart, I know somebody could use them. Phoenix also has a warehouse full of Hossiers, especially after the runoffs.
The thing is, are you racing in competition or just doing HPDE?
If you are just doing HPDE then find some 200TDW tires and go have fun. HPDE can be the biggest pecker measuring contest there is, I've seen guys dump tons of money into cars just for bragging rights, but you get those same drivers into class racing and they suck, their speed is all in their wallet.

I would to figure out a way to pick up Some of your extra 18” stickies. How many? Where are they?

 

[blacksheep-1]

I would to figure out a way to pick up Some of your extra 18” stickies. How many? Where are they?

It depends,when I was at RA, I posted on here, sometimes we run 1 car, sometimes 2. Sometimes we have a crapload of tires, sometimes we don't.
You can call Kohr or Phoenix Performance and buy them there.

 

[Tonymustang302]

It depends,when I was at RA, I posted on here, sometimes we run 1 car, sometimes 2. Sometimes we have a crapload of tires, sometimes we don't.
You can call Kohr or Phoenix Performance and buy them there.

Dean does not respond.

 

[Dave_W]

turn in feels pretty damn good. It's just when I get settled in to these sweepers that it feels like the car starts developing understeer. The only things that seem to help when I'm at this point is either lifting or inducing oversteer.

One possibility, and it might not be your situation but I'm just throwing it out there, is that you're trying to carry a bit too much speed at the apex. The "fine at turn in, changing to understeer at the apex" can be from not slowing enough on the brakes, and you end up using front tire scrub to finish slowing the car at the apex. Try starting your braking a tad earlier, so you're done braking and actually starting to apply throttle at the apex. Again, might not be your particular situation, but overdriving the corner can lead to these symptoms.

Could also be setup / balance, where shock valving (e.g., stiff rear compression) is giving you good "support" during corner entry, but once you reach steady-state in a long sweeper and the shocks don't have as much influence, the balance moves to understeer.

 

[blacksheep-1]

Dean does not respond.

We're tire testing this week witht he new GT4 car, ours is not ready so For dis loaning us one, it's a very busy time.

 

[KJNVUDU]

Dave - I suspect that's pretty close to spot on. I think I'm trying to be fast in and fast out a lot of the time.
Having the 280tw Bridgestones back on may be just what I need.
I was a good 4sec slower than with the cups and I didn't have as much confidence in the higher speed turns, but I feel like I can learn more about me and the car with less grip.

I'm actually happy with the results from last week because it felt more like a learning experience.
I've proven to myself that my car is pretty quick around the course. Now I'm going to try and keep the ego at bay and work on me being quick.

 

[Egparson202]

Dave - I suspect that's pretty close to spot on. I think I'm trying to be fast in and fast out a lot of the time.
Having the 280tw Bridgestones back on may be just what I need.
I was a good 4sec slower than with the cups and I didn't have as much confidence in the higher speed turns, but I feel like I can learn more about me and the car with less grip.

I'm actually happy with the results from last week because it felt more like a learning experience.
I've proven to myself that my car is pretty quick around the course. Now I'm going to try and keep the ego at bay and work on me being quick.

Yes! The Driver Mod. That’s speed that goes with you from event to event, from track to track and from car to car.

Work on your technique, on doing the right things right. You’ll be quick.