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Future of Mustang Engines

Sesshomurai

jimprw said:
I hate to say it gang, but we who worship the V8 are gradually making our way to the happy hunting ground. The kids who are now in their teens and twenties won't be able to afford any performance car until they get good jobs and are somewhat established in life. That's anywhere from 5 - 15 years from now. And what will be available to them when they're ready to buy? Not V8s. And while they might appreciate Dad's or Grandpa's (ouch) V8 classic or reissue muscle car, they're going to be more influenced by what is coming out in the next few years. Their nostalgia will be for the next generation of performance cars - their sound, their size and (reduced) weight and, yes, their gas mileage - if they're even powered by petroleum products at all. And that is what I think the auto executives understand in spades. We fell in love with what we wanted when we were kids - and the market for the current reissue muscle cars is us. I think we'll all be amazed at what these V6, hybrid and electric cars will actually do performance wise (check out the NSX concept). My personal hope is that our current crop of pony cars will still find love in 2030. I think they will.

People said that 20 years ago. Heck even back in the 70's during the gas crisis. Fact is, the market want's V8's and muscle cars require them. A twin-turbo muscle car? huh? Hybrid? Electric? makes no sense. Different market. That's why we have Prius, Fiesta, Volt, etc. The real question is "will people want muscle cars in the future"? They will be more taxed and more expensive, but there will always be buyers.

What I think you will see in the future is what you've seen from the past 10 years. More efficient (and complex) combustion engines.

But in my humble opinion, you won't see a frankenstein muscle car running parts from the "tuner market". That would cross-over markets. If Ford or anyone wanted to make tuner, euro-style motors they will put them in a new car entirely, market it in "europe only" (e.g. the Focus ST) or not at all.

I'm pretty confident there won't be a TT or Hybrid mustang....
 
Friend at work (Finance guy, of all things) races a Dodge Neon. He is rebuilding after a motor meltdown a few months ago, and is using a new Garrett TT that will have his Neon at 525 awhp. He says that he has no or very little lag, and that the torque curve with this new TT is very good. Should be fun to see some of his new YouTube videos this year.
 
Ford is already poking the Mustang into the tuner world

Boss wheel
19inchBoss302paintedwheel.jpg


Initial D AE86 wheel
p9.jpg

;D



Tuner scene is dieing anyways, Evo is in its last iteration, Sti is going upscale, Hondas don't have high revving vtech yo, and my understanding is that the scene is almost dead in Japan other than a few holdout areas, and young people are more interested in kei cars. Yeah there is the new Subuyota and the Z and a few others still but I don't think the Z sells that well anymore based on the amount of dust on them at the local dealer.
 
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For what it's worth, a recent review of the Milwaukee Auto Show. If they're saying this in Milwaukee, one might assume that there is a general desire or expectation that the platform will evolve:

Car That DESPARITELY Needs To Jump Into The 21st Century: Ford Mustang (all versions). I’m sorry, big power with a chassis and suspension as sophisticated as an ox cart does not make for a great car. Yes, it is the best handling live axle car on the planet, but every other manufacturer gave up on live axles eons ago! Fortunately, the next generation of Mustang, coming in the next couple of years, will share in Ford’s Global Platform policy and be a much more sophisticated car. Could the ‘Stang become a world-class sports car? Not as long as it’s stuck in 1967.
Continue reading on Examiner.com 2012 Greater Milwaukee Auto Show: Awards and Highlights - Milwaukee sports car | Examiner.com http://www.examiner.com/sports-car-in-milwaukee/2012-greater-milwaukee-auto-show-awards-and-highlights#ixzz1oHEuUG7b
 
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MA
I must be old.

I can't accept the notion of an AWD Mustang. Or a V6TT GT. I know nothing about what today's 20 something wants from a car, or how they even view the current breed of muscle cars, but if they are the one's to dictate what we drive in a few years, we're screwed. All I know about most of the people in that age range is that they are among what I call the "Nintendo Generation". PM me if you need an explanation of it, I don't want to offend the 20 somethings who aren't in that category.

If history is to repeat itself, I can see Ford forging ahead with such radical changes based upon their forward thinking of market trends and how to offer products designed around meeting anticipated market trends. We all like to criticize the Mustang II, but you know what? The Mustang II was the best selling body style Mustang of all time, and the reason was that Ford anticipated the gas crisis, anticipated the influx of small, sporty foreign cars gaining market share, and they were able to market the car fairly well. There were several other factors too long to post of why Ford saw fit to introduce the Mustang II, but what I'm trying to say is there is a clear movement in the car industry to move to high compression and or turbo power in small displacement motors and make claims about how these new engines offer V8 'feel' and 4 cylinder economy.

Could the 650 HP Shelby be the swan song of the classic American muscle car? Perhaps. If its true, I can say I won't be letting this 2012 Boss out of my hands for as long as possible then.

I had suspected that the 2014 Stang would have some variant of the current 5.0, with specific output approaching ridiculous levels of HP. 475 HP N/A Coyote with 30 mpg anyone?
 
Hmm, I consider myself part of the "Nintendo Generation" and I also have been a long time fan of muscle cars. What does it all mean?
 
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askjeffro said:
Hmm, I consider myself part of the "Nintendo Generation" and I also have been a long time fan of muscle cars. What does it all mean?
Muscle car in the classic sense is still very much alive - 45 years later. Our enthusiasm for our Bosses and the originals is proof of that. What I was thinking was that if you were now, say, 12 years old and just beginning to get the car bug, what would you consider the most desirable performance car 15 years from now when you were 27 and could finally swing a new one of what would be out there? Would it be a naturally aspirated or blown V8 from 2013 or would it be the current tech and offerings of the 2027 model year? ;)
 
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CaliMR said:
They could probably do it with direct injection.
+1 I'm pretty sure this is coming sooner than later. My guess, it will start with a direct injected offering in the 2014 redesign. Conservatively speaking, it would be in the base Mustang to start - probably even an ecoboost direct injection 4 cylinder making somewhere around the 300 hp. Depending what they work out in the next couple of years, I wouldn't be surprised if the GT motor is one of these 3.2 RoushYates V6 types with direct injection and forced induction of some type. The specialty cars, Bosses or Mach 1s may have direct injected 5.8/351s and who knows but the Shelby might be still be in V8 form pumping out 750 HP until the end of the 2010s.

Also, depending on how much longer the nostalgia smoke hangs around in the room, you could also see Mustangs splitting into new platform and "classic" offerings. The former would be as outlined above and the classics still sporting V8s until or unless the whole oil supply thing gets out of hand. The classics would be limited production vehicles and would be proportionately expensive since the price couldn't be offset by volume. Sounds crazy? Maybe. But just look at the electric guitar market - an original 1959 Gibson Les Paul would set you back over $100K. A current Les Paul sells for a discounted price of around $1800 while a modern recreation of a 1959 Les Paul would set you back around $3K. What's keeping automakers going down the same path?
 

MLM

Mike
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I recently heard that Land Rover is using the Ford ecoboost DI 4 in the Evoque. ??? 278 HP or so.
 
jimprw said:
askjeffro said:
Hmm, I consider myself part of the "Nintendo Generation" and I also have been a long time fan of muscle cars. What does it all mean?
Muscle car in the classic sense is still very much alive - 45 years later. Our enthusiasm for our Bosses and the originals is proof of that. What I was thinking was that if you were now, say, 12 years old and just beginning to get the car bug, what would you consider the most desirable performance car 15 years from now when you were 27 and could finally swing a new one of what would be out there? Would it be a naturally aspirated or blown V8 from 2013 or would it be the current tech and offerings of the 2027 model year? ;)

My 14 year old nephew's favorite car is the Ford GT, and he almost wets himself when I take him for rides in the Boss. The turbo/import vs American has been around a long time, as when I was in high school the main factions were trucks, musclecars, and imports (BMW and Japanese import guys were the same clique). What I am seeing as the move with my nephews and their friends is more away from cars as performance at all and toward them being just a way to get from point A to point B. There were plenty of people like that 20 years ago too, but now there are a lot more it seems. And my understanding is that the trend is much stronger in Japan and some of the other foreign markets
 

MLM

Mike
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CaliMR said:
What I am seeing as the move with my nephews and their friends is more away from cars as performance at all and toward them being just a way to get from point A to point B. There were plenty of people like that 20 years ago too, but now there are a lot more it seems. And my understanding is that the trend is much stronger in Japan and some of the other foreign markets

Indeed it seems young adults would rather surf the 'net than have a car. http://business.blogs.cnn.com/2011/12/08/car-or-internet-toss-up-for-young-adults/
 
I have tried hypermiling in my old car, my highway mpg went from 16 to 18. I could see how that would become a fun way to drive, and I know a couple people with Prii or similar that do it more for the challenge than for the savings.
 

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