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Toe Heel Braking

Sesshomurai

Can someone offer a good explanation of how to do toe heel braking in the boss, why its a useful technique and when I'd want to do it?

I kinda sorta think I understand it, but would like some explanation from the experienced crowd.
 
From the Home Page, type in heel/toe in the search box and you'll get several threads discussing the topic. Basically it's a useful technique on a road course because it allows you to maintain braking pressure while downshifting the car as you enter a turn. With your right foot on the brake, you roll your toe (or your heel depending on how your legs bend) to "blip" the throttle to get the revs matched with the lower gear when making the downshift.
 

Sesshomurai

I see. So the idea is to keep the RPM's revved to the gear you're going into to, to avoid the extra time/work on the trans to rev up or down to that gear.

PS. Yeah, I should tried the search first *slaps head*.
 

drano38

Wayne
1,130
318
I read about it and finally got it figured out at Track Attack. Them riding along helped me figure out I was doing it completely wrong, and they got me straightened out. Then I used in in the afternoon during our track time.
Since you're new to the concept, I'll pile on to Gary's post.

Towards end of braking zone,
Keep braking
Push in clutch
Blip throttle with heal/edge/whatever of right foot (while still braking)
Downshift
Release clutch

Think of it as clutch, blip, shift, release clutch.

We have 2 choices--heal/toe, or get off the brake to blip the throttle for the downshift. Doing heal/toe lets us shift and brake simultaneously, so we can run fast longer to the corner.
Find a quiet country road (one is 2 blocks from my house), make sure noone is behind you, and practice from the speed limit a 4th-to-3rd heal/toe downshift. Rinse, repeat.
 

PeteInCT

#LS-378 - So many Porsche's, so little time....
Moderator
2,848
13
Connecticut
I found the Sullivan racing pedals (specifically the gas pedal) made heel/toe very easy on the Boss. For me, this pedal allows me to use the same braking technique with my right foot as I did before and also gives me easy access to blip the throttle. All I do is roll my foot (ankle actually) to the right from it's normal braking position and I'm on the throttle. Before, it required a different foot angle and/or a repositioning of my heel onto the throttle (based on what technique I was using).

The only thing you need to get used to with these pedals is that the brake and gas are now very close together. If you get sloppy with your right foot on the brake you'll also be hitting the gas at the same time.

Lastly, if anyone else is to drive your car (i.e. a Ford technician) they need to know to watch for this else they'll but your car into a wall by accident. The Ford mechanic that replaced my wiring harness was having fun pulling my LS into the service bay :eek:
 
1,255
0
GA
PeteInCT said:
The only thing you need to get used to with these pedals is that the brake and gas are now very close together. If you get sloppy with your right foot on the brake you'll also be hitting the gas at the same time.

I have "clown shoes" that I don't wear anymore since I end up HTing when I don't want to even with the stock pedals. :)
 

Justin

Save the dawn for your dishes!!!
When I drive with my boots on (uniform for the navy NWU's) I hit the gas pedal and brake at the same time all the time. gets annoying lol
 
1,255
0
GA
Justin said:
When I drive with my boots on (uniform for the navy NWU's) I hit the gas pedal and brake at the same time all the time. gets annoying lol

Boondockers? Those are definitely clown shoes. ;D
 

Justin

Save the dawn for your dishes!!!
PJWANNABE said:
Justin said:
When I drive with my boots on (uniform for the navy NWU's) I hit the gas pedal and brake at the same time all the time. gets annoying lol

Boondockers? Those are definitely clown shoes. ;D
no boondockers anymore. 9" all leather boots. I use 10" Matterhorn ranger boots
 
So I assume most of your don't use the "Clutchless Downshift method", where you drop the car into neutral (no clutch), blip the throttle and drop into lower gear (again without the clutch)... I know some "Ricer Racers" that use that method, so they don't have to touch the clutch (Only works in downshifting though).

Anyone do this?
 

Justin

Save the dawn for your dishes!!!
PJWANNABE said:
Justin said:
PJWANNABE said:
Justin said:
When I drive with my boots on (uniform for the navy NWU's) I hit the gas pedal and brake at the same time all the time. gets annoying lol

Boondockers? Those are definitely clown shoes. ;D
no boondockers anymore. 9" all leather boots. I use 10" Matterhorn ranger boots

Do they still wear the dungarees that show off your package? ;)
nope those were replaced with utilities which looked like a garage mechanic. Those were then replaced with nwu which is a blue camp version of the bdu's
 

ArizonaBOSS

Because racecar.
Moderator
8,523
2,331
Arizona, USA
rpm3dinc said:
So I assume most of your don't use the "Clutchless Downshift method", where you drop the car into neutral (no clutch), blip the throttle and drop into lower gear (again without the clutch)... I know some "Ricer Racers" that use that method, so they don't have to touch the clutch (Only works in downshifting though).

Anyone do this?

Absolutely not; this forces your synchros to do all the work and wears them out prematurely. Use the clutch--it's there for a reason, and a lot less expensive to replace than an entire transmission.
 
Unless you replaced your tranny with a dog box, just use the clutch. Motorcycle trannies are pretty different from car trannies and have less power and weight attached to them, allowing it. Ricers probably learned from watching Biker Boyz and FnF
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
darreng505 said:
Can someone offer a good explanation of how to do toe heel braking in the boss, why its a useful technique and when I'd want to do it?

I kinda sorta think I understand it, but would like some explanation from the experienced crowd.

drano38's explanation is right, but I thought I'd add some exercises to help:

At a stop or parked, practice blipping the throttle with pressure on the brake. I use the ball of my foot and my big toe to brake, and pivot/swing my foot around the side of the brake pedal to hit the gas pedal with the right side of my foot. You have to figure out what will work for you, and I think that's safest to do when parked. Eventually, you should be able to get to the point where your brake pedal is floored and you can keep the brake in the same position and stab the throttle and bump the revs ~40%.

I suggest starting with the actual shifts at say about 40 mph going from 4 to 3 with just light brake pressure to get used to the movement and positioning.

Work your way up in starting speed and brake pressure. Eventually get to the point where you can full brake and make the shift smoothly. Then work on other shifts like the 3-2 and 5-4. After that drop 2 gears in rapid succession 4-3-2 approaching a turn or stop.

I also practice doing 2-1, but it's not really practical for the track, and I'd only recommend doing it with a double-clutch to save that synchro.


ArizonaGT said:
rpm3dinc said:
So I assume most of your don't use the "Clutchless Downshift method", where you drop the car into neutral (no clutch), blip the throttle and drop into lower gear (again without the clutch)... I know some "Ricer Racers" that use that method, so they don't have to touch the clutch (Only works in downshifting though).

Anyone do this?

Absolutely not; this forces your synchros to do all the work and wears them out prematurely. Use the clutch--it's there for a reason, and a lot less expensive to replace than an entire transmission.

Done correctly, there is no stress on any parts. I only wish I was good enough to be able to do it...and to not have learned on any of *my* cars. :D
 

ArizonaBOSS

Because racecar.
Moderator
8,523
2,331
Arizona, USA
Grant 302 said:
Done correctly, there is no stress on any parts. I only wish I was good enough to be able to do it...and to not have learned on any of *my* cars. :D

LOL...

The only reason I would ever consider doing that is if I had some sort of clutch failure and needed to limp the car somewhere.
 
Another option instead of getting a wider throttle is to get a wider brake pedal. A friend of mine got his SRP pedals with a 1" wider brake pedal and centered that's 1/2" wider on each side. I might do the same.
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
Can I get the third option, just the right foot? ;D

ArizonaGT said:
LOL...

The only reason I would ever consider doing that is if I had some sort of clutch failure and needed to limp the car somewhere.

At least in a car we have neutral...I broke the clutch cable on a motorcycle once and had to just jam the gears to get her home.
 
ArizonaGT said:
Third option is this:

clown.jpg

That is the option I took. My street shoes are 4E and are a little too wide so they sometimes hit both pedals if I'm not careful, my driving shoes I bought narrower than is comfortable to avoid the issue (plus I had an import at the time so the pedals were tiny). It isn't ideal but is manageable.
 

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