2014 Z28 vs Boss LS

[ArizonaBOSS]

There is no question that Chevrolet has built one heck of a Pony car in the new 2014 Z28 but for them to provide a video comparing their new 2014 Z28 that comes with a 427 cubic engine, upgraded rubber/wheel size, dry-sump oil system and other racing goodies compared to a 2012 302 Laguna Seca model with a much smaller engine and rubber/wheels just shows how desperate Chevrolet and GM is to beat Ford in the Pony car market.

Back in the sixties I remember when the '67 Camaro Z28 came out just after the New Year in 1967 and it was very hard to recognize one of these special cars due to no external identification other than their wide racing stripes and obviously they were very fast right out of the box.

The 602 Z28's that were built in 1967 were developed for one reason and one reason only and that was to be a contender for the SCCA Trans AM racing series. Of course in 1969 Ford built their own SCCA Trans AM contender as in the 1969 Boss 302 and won the SCCA Trans Am series the following year with Parnelli Jones at the wheel of a 1970 Boss 302.

I certainly look forward to seeing one of these new 2014 Camaro Z28's and suggest that they will be a very fast and well balanced car.

Having said that it is hard for me to comprehend how Chevrolet can post and gloat about a video comparing their new 2014 Z28 model which boasts an engine that has an additional 125 cubic inches, costs tens of thousand dollars more than a 2012 Boss 302 LS model that was built 2 years earlier.

One of the biggest differences I find between Ford and GM when it comes to their corporate philosophy is that Ford tries very hard to maintain their heritage and roots as in what did they did in order to build the 2 year limited edition 2012 and 2013 Boss 302 cars.

If GM had built a new generation 2014 Z28 with a 302 cubic inch engine as they did back in 1967 thru 1969 I would have much more respect for the new Z28 and for GM but they did not.

Their answer to one up one on Ford was to stuff a 427 cubic inch engine in their Pony car along with numerous racing goodies and will come with an extremely high MSRP and then claim victory over Ford's small block 302.

You gotta love this comparison by GM!

8)

I can appreciate your point about staying true to the heritage of the car but I'm sure that achieving the performance while remaining profitable is far more important for GM right now; hence the "parts bin" 7.0L engine from the C6Z06. It's already proven and likely minimal engine-specific testing needed to drop into the Camaro chassis, which means less time spent in engineering/development and therefore they can allocate that R&D cash elsewhere (or not spend it at all).

 

[Noellenchris]

LOL wow there is a lot of polarized hate going on here.
A good car is a good car is a good car.

The weight loss program for that car, coupled with dry sump oiling, Ti internals, carbon brakes, magnetic dampers etc etc etc make that thing really special.
It's really purpose built and focused for excelling at 1 thing only. I'm excited to see this car come, and is more driver focused than most.
Notice that all high end sports cars from the European camp are all DCT these days, but this is still a true manual.

Yes, they've massaged and worked with a pig of a platform (heavy). But it's been proven that they can make it work (1LE, ZL1). This amps it up exponentially.
This car is actually a few steps closer to "a race car for the streets" than our Bosses are. Plain and simple.

The thing was tuned at Multimatic, and the fact that it rocks 305 section front tires and can still turn in suggests work done on the front end to deal with scrub, ackerman (perhaps, or at least one can hope). It's a proper car. I'm with NFSBoss

Driving on a majority of the roads in the US is going to be exciting with 305's on the front. Those tires work great on a flat track, but will suck on the street. If the roads have any groves at all it will pull like crazy. All this does keep Ford and Chevy busy in competition and it is fun being a consumer getting to play with all the new cars. Maybe someday we will have some competition for the supercars.

 

[PP0001]

I can appreciate your point about staying true to the heritage of the car but I'm sure that achieving the performance while remaining profitable is far more important for GM right now; hence the "parts bin" 7.0L engine from the C6Z06. It's already proven and likely minimal engine-specific testing needed to drop into the Camaro chassis, which means less time spent in engineering/development and therefore they can allocate that R&D cash elsewhere (or not spend it at all).

Agreed that GM certainly improved the performance line of their Pony car with the new Z28 and there is no question that the new Z28 will be a great performing vehicle with respect to acceleration, braking and handling. I also agree that this car will be profitable based on the many GM enthusiasts out there that will buy this great performance car.

The point I was trying to make was that by the GM brass comparing a new 2014 Z28 to a 2012 Boss 302 LS does not make any sense based on the fact that these two Pony cars are not in the same model year let alone having a much different engine size, etc. and probably most importantly a big difference in MSRP.

If we want a level playing field based on GM's recent video and criteria how about we give Ford until the 2016 model year to come up with a new high performance Mustang and in 3 years then let's compare that new 2016 high performance Mustang with the 2014 Z28 but I don't think Ford would stoop as low as GM has?

I am actually quite surprised at GM issuing this comparison especially based on the fact that the 2012 Boss 302 LS cars came out in February 2011 which is almost 3 years ago and to come to think of it PP0001 had it's 3rd birthday last month.

 

[13Boss#3328]

LOL wow there is a lot of polarized hate going on here.
A good car is a good car is a good car.

The weight loss program for that car, coupled with dry sump oiling, Ti internals, carbon brakes, magnetic dampers etc etc etc make that thing really special.
It's really purpose built and focused for excelling at 1 thing only. I'm excited to see this car come, and is more driver focused than most.
Notice that all high end sports cars from the European camp are all DCT these days, but this is still a true manual.

Yes, they've massaged and worked with a pig of a platform (heavy). But it's been proven that they can make it work (1LE, ZL1). This amps it up exponentially.
This car is actually a few steps closer to "a race car for the streets" than our Bosses are. Plain and simple.

The thing was tuned at Multimatic, and the fact that it rocks 305 section front tires and can still turn in suggests work done on the front end to deal with scrub, ackerman (perhaps, or at least one can hope). It's a proper car. I'm with NFSBoss

I like what you said.

It seems like this Z28 can crush any mustang around the road course STOCK to STOCK.

But wait a minute, it might cost over $60 K and I got my Boss 302 for $43 K

If I spend $10 K ( full Cortex system with JRi & 305 18 inch tires), I can see the performance gap getting smaller.

Still, the Z28 dry sump and may be better cooling system ...etc

The rationale of the story, we are living in the golden era of performance cars.

Good for GM and good for Ford!

 

[Johnson13]

The Z28 has more cubes than both the BOSS and GT500 as well no supercharger, and beats them both around the "Ring". GM seams to be very good at responding to what Ford does, but not so good at being first to market. The Z28 is very nice and race ready, but imagine what driving it around daily would be like when most of us feel our lowly BOSS' are to much for the street. I too love the pony wars and am VERY happy with the one I bought as it is a damn bad ass car that I can enjoy in any venue and it has soooo much room for me to imrove if I choose to.

 

[TMSBOSS]

The Z28 has more cubes than both the BOSS and GT500 as well no supercharger, and beats them both around the "Ring". GM seams to be very good at responding to what Ford does, but not so good at being first to market. The Z28 is very nice and race ready, but imagine what driving it around daily would be like when most of us feel our lowly BOSS' are to much for the street. I too love the pony wars and am VERY happy with the one I bought as it is a damn bad ass car that I can enjoy in any venue and it has soooo much room for me to imrove if I choose to.

+1

I have a Boss and a C-3 Corvette for toys. Both brands have their advantages. I like both for what they are good at.

Two different eras which produced great cars at the time.

Glad to have seen both pony wars.

 

[Jimmy Pribble]

My baseline statement is this: I love the new Z28. I love that kind of hard-edged commitment to it's purpose. It is what the Laguna Seca should have been. IMO, the LS does not differentiate itself from the standard Boss enough. The Z28 is a wicked car and except for the fake rear vents and the hideous front splitter, I think it looks great good.

So what's the problem?

Well, the Z28 is kind of...dumb. Let me explain. One of the things I love most about the Boss is that it was developed out of a racing program and once it was produced, it continued to race on a professional level. We can buy turn-key Boss race cars from Ford, or like many of the teams racing, we can convert our cars to racing cars. There isn't anything that difficult about it, because they race with stock engines.

The Z28 was developed on a public road. Okay, the Nurburgring is also a race track, but the Z28 wasn't developed from racing, nor does it appear that it is destined to race much of anywhere. The wheels/tires and brakes are illegal in most of the classes I'm thinking it could work. And the engine displacement makes it illegal for others. So, if it does manage to race somewhere, it's probably going to have to downgrade its brakes, wheels, and tires. I bet the mod community can't wait for that. Will they have "Weight GAIN" thread on their forum? : Even if it could find a fair class, I can promise you that it won't be against it's traditional rival - the Boss Mustang. That's like UT not playing A&M anymore. Oh, wait.

But Jimmy, it only claims to be "track ready" not "race ready." They only want to win the HPDE!

Well, okay. I admit it's not going to fun to have those Car and Driver Lightning Lap numbers put in our face, but if Z28 owner's show-up at their local HPDE expecting to find a bunch of unmodified Bosses to pick-on...well, I have some bad news for them. In the end, some of them might still come out ahead, but they will have to work for it.

And at what cost? $65K is the number I keep hearing (totally unconfirmed). To still not be the fastest car at the HPDE? If it is because somebody loves Z28s, then more power to them. But since I am ASSuming this car will be a terrible daily driver, I'm just wondering what it's for.

I'm tired and at work, so probably did not articulate my thoughts perfectly. Anywhere, there is my first stab at it.

 

[PP0001]

And at what cost? $65K is the number I keep hearing (totally unconfirmed). To still not be the fastest car at the HPDE? If it is because somebody loves Z28s, then more power to them. But since I am ASSuming this car will be a terrible daily driver, I'm just wondering what it's for.

I'm tired and at work, so probably did not articulate my thoughts perfectly. Anywhere, there is my first stab at it.
[/quote]

For being tired and at the end of your work week I thought you articulated yourself very well!!

8)

 

[coboss]

I still don't get it. When the Boss was released, everyone pointed out how much better it was on the track than a Camaro SS. Of course, it was $15,000 more than a Camaro SS, but people still gloated.

Now, Chevy brings out the Z/28. They took the Boos philosophy ten steps further, deleting sound deadening, air conditioning, figuring out how to stuff huge tires under it, putting the most advanced suspension system in the world on it (one that is bought straight from GM by several supercar manufacturers), exotic brakes, and then rescuing an awesome piece of engineering from the garbage can in the form of the 7.0 Z06 engine.

Do you really think a Z/28 buyer is going to drive along thinking GM should have built a special 302 cu in engine so that Boss owner's feelings wouldn't be hurt? If it makes you feel better, the 7.0 engine weighs LESS than the Boss 302 engine. So maybe GM was measuring engines by the pound rather than cubic inches?

Get over it. Time marches on, and GM now owns bragging rights in the Pony Car Wars. Your Boss is still the same car it was yesterday.

 

[VoodooBoss]

The Z/28 is packing the goods but no Mag Ride suspension. Instead a dialed in, and lighter, Multimatic suspension setup. Photos from SEMA.

 

[Jimmy Pribble]

Thanks for the pics! That is the nicest future HPDE winner I have ever seen.

 

[BOSS343]

I think it will be a great car. I would love to see one on track in person.

 

[WinterSucks]

Like Jimmy Pribble pointed out long ago, this is a fast car with no class (that means two things ). It's marketed as a track car, but I think anyone with enough experience to spend that much on a track car will look at other options since they probably have a racing class in mind and this one fits no where. So the only people left to buy them are collectors and inexperienced fools with too much money who will be jumping on the track with barely street legal tires. I think we will see most of those guys crash or drive 50mph the whole time (like a Ferrari poser I met at an HPDE, not exaggerating his slowness)... I think most of you guys will agree that those tires are not safe to learn on if they have R-compound breakaway characteristics ( I have read that they are pretty much R-comps). I am going to bet that some of these will bite the dust very quickly on the street just due to those tires.

It is pretty clear to me that GM has inept management, hopefully that will change. The parts list of the Z/28 and the MSRP really shows, IMO, that the product manager in charge had no idea what he was doing, other than to badmouth Ford. Ford is smart enough not to make a 75K Mustang just for bragging rights. It does not seem like they had a clear goal, just a budget and a parts bin. No regard for making a product that is actually usable to the customer.

That being said, it is a good car and will be very fast in the right hands. I just don't think it deserves the Z/28 badge, and I doubt will not make any significant waves in the real world. I will worry about the 1LE, since that is the most appropriate contender. I am not trying to be a Masshole, just reacting to GM being arrogant thugs.

 

[BOSS343]

So I know this thread is about the Z/28, a fantastic car on paper and one I would like to get some seat time in. But the mention of the 1LE, has anyone seen or raced one on the road course?

I also agree with Rick its a sweet lookin ride and just check out them MEATS on there! Are you serious! It would take an entire forest of Hevea brasiliensis to make a set of tires for that monster.

 

[Domestic Product]

arggg, can we move this to other cars, so not interested.....