Captdistraction's ST2/GTR build thread Build Thread

[captdistraction]

 

[captdistraction]

lol, so not much has changed since the last picture of the car getting pooped on. Its been sitting at home while I try to find the motivation to deal with the engine timing chain rattle/moan noise. I'll be pulling the motor or at least the cover in the next month or so to investigate and hopefully repair. I've lost interest in the project (#firstworldproblems, toy racecar doesn't work) but I think I'll realign the goal to make at least one test session before the end of the year (or seriously re-evaluate what I'm doing with this thing in my garage).

Hopefully upward and onward on the next update.

 

[VoodooBoss]

Well that's not good news. Hopefully you'll get motivated and get it finished.

 

[byronj]

Dogs pooping in pictures like that make me lol I almost spit my beer out. Good luck on your project

 

[superhero]

You have gone down a long hard road with your car and inspired a lot of people with your build. I know this may sound like BS but I feel like your going to catch a huge break after you pass this last hurdle. It just sucks when certain things are out of your control. Every time I see a post in this thread by you I hope to read great news.
The car is a killer look at and is set up for battle on a track. Good Luck and keep your thoughts positive.

Least important... Why do we all stare at our dogs when they POOP?
I do the same thing with my dog. Its not like its something we never seen before...Lol

Keep the faith Brother.

 

[captdistraction]

So an update, finally tore the car apart after finishing the garage build (which turned out spectacular).

What I found was unpleasant. The timing system looks great, all the chains, guides, tensioners, gear and phasers were fine from a physical appearance. I went as far as pulling out the oil pump and that's where this gets puzzling.

The oil pump with 400 miles on it has scoring on the front and back faces of the gears and housing, and the "teeth/lobes" of the gears are scuffed/scored. ArizonaBoss and another friend suggested opening up the oil filter and magnet-tracing the pan, but nothing of interest was found (some typical very light hint of coppery/brassy particulate in the filter media only under very bright light). The plug did have some darker metallic goo on it, but not an unusual amount for the first 400 miles.

So, what the hell happened? I know that pump looked fine going in, was well oiled before first start up, and the motor was allowed to rotate over before actually firing up. Also, if it scored itself, where's the resultant material? I don't see how it could get past the filter, but not sure. Possibly it just scored/dented itself? Also, based on this description and following pictures, everyone feel pretty confident that its the source of my mystery noise when warm? (My personal thought is that it was the noise I was hearing, along with a mild loss of oil pressure allowing the chains to slack slightly). Also, possibly an issue with factory oil pickup tube depth against the moroso pan? I measured it previously to .25" with clay, but wasn't the most scientific measurement ever taken.

I don't think I found enough material to warrant pulling the motor and the pan to check the bottom side bearings, and cam bearings under the bridges look fine and fresh (plugs also look normal). My plan for now is to put a factory oil pump back in and run it like that, I have not heard back from MMR yet, but just emailed them yesterday. Hopefully this is just a mild roadbump and I can get back to it, I'm just worried of a larger issue looming over the horizon (as usual).

Pictures to follow:

 

[TMSBOSS]

Have you pulled any of the bearing caps on the bottom end to check for unusual wear? You may have to replace the bolts if you do, but this would be a good way to know how the bottom end looks.

If there is no other damage found, the pump is the problem and the solution.

Good luck!!

 

[captdistraction]

All the fasteners throughout the build are aftermarket ARP, and I believe the studs on the bottom are re-usable. That being said, is it a necessity at this point if I'm not finding particulate elsewhere? Good idea no doubt, but definitely a process to either drop the K and pull the pan.

 

[TMSBOSS]

Agree. I am stuck In an era when the pan came off before the oil pump. My bad.

Hope you have her together soon.

 

[06mach1]

It sure looks like some metal (or an abrasive material) went thru that oil pump or it was starved of oil itself. Maybe the sump to pan clearance was causing a restriction.

 

[captdistraction]

From Moroso:
Be sure you are using the correct pickup with your Moroso oil pan. Check our catalog on website for the proper P/N. Recommended clearance between pickup cup and oil pan bottom is 3/16” to 3/8”. Their catalog suggests the factory pickup is correct for that pan.

During break-in, never was the oil low nor was the car operated in a high g-load environment. I've let it rev up some, but gave it appropriate mileage before allowing higher RPM use (and even then for the most part the car didn't have much use outside street driving and hilly/highway use to try to optimize break-in). Though I've had nothing but oiling issues, with MMR motors. Is it possible the pan is the culprit? I'm so incredibly sick of this car and its bulls--- problems, but hopefully can find out an exact fix (acknowledging that the biggest problem is the decision making I've had on vendors and parts into this car) . Need something to turn positive out of this project.

Break-in oil was nothing fancy, conventional 10w40, but that's exactly what the builder asked for. I didn't run an exterior oil cooling loop as I prefer break-in done with the most simple oiling layout possible.

 

[ArizonaBOSS]

FWIW I use the same pan and factory pickup without issue.

 

[Tucson 302]

FWIW I use the same pan and factory pickup without issue.

Ditto

 

[captdistraction]

Installed the oe pump tonight. Will finish some oil cooling and telemetry setup but I hope to fire it back up this weekend and see if this was the fix.

 

[captdistraction]

To clarify, I installed a used oem pump for a couple reasons: we knew it made ok oil pressure without noise and would let me find out quickly if the mmr pump was the issue, and if for some reason there is metal being passed through it I'm not tearing up an expensive aftermarket one.

I'll plan on pulling this pump out maybe over the holiday season and if it looks ok, then I'll put some billet gears back in it and go. Will fabricate the oil cooler loop today and hopefully get it close enough to fire back up

 

[captdistraction]

An update: its mostly back together, fabricated up the oil cooler loop and various bits as I'll begin race prep in the hope that the motor problems are behind me. Should be able to fire it up today or tomorrow.

On the oil loop it's a close fit with the motor lowered. Also I have two pair each of senders for the oil temp and pressure ( a pair of gauges and two go to the telemetry system). Seems complicated but after roasting a few motors it's just something for my rampant paranoia. Anyone see any issues with how it's routed?

While it does run along the bumper beam, it should be ok in a frontal impact to some degree which was my largest concern.

 

[302 Hi Pro]

CD:

Yep, it is a tight fit coming off of the filter sandwich plate at the oil filter mount. Can't tell from the pics but, do the external oil cooler lines contact the red sway bar?

The sway bar has constant movement on track, so I would keep a close eye on that area.

Sure looks good and nice progress. Hoping to read more good news from you after you have her back together and running. I suspect it will take a few hundred miles of quite operation before you know for sure.

All the best, and good racing in 2016,
302 Hi Pro

 

[captdistraction]

No, the closest point is the swaybar bushing bracket to the crimp side of the oil line fittings and that's about 5/8" (and the motor is on poly mounts). I don't expect there to be any clearance issues there, but its close, had to use the 45* fittings to route out of that area, especially since the motor is lowered from stock. However routing them towards the bracket was done on purpose since that minimizes the cable exposure to any portion of the bar that pivots/moves.

 

[captdistraction]

will zip ties hold up to the temps expected to be seen through those lines? I just thought about that. Hadn't had a problem in the past, but I've also never worked with the nylon braided line before, just stainless.

 

[2012-Boss]

Zip ties will hold up fine for securing the lines. I have been using them for the past few years to secure my oil lines.