PSA: MT82 Fluid For Track Use

[Grant 302]

Thinking about this a bit more, I think I was wrong to suggest that heel-toe or rev matching somehow makes the gear change easier on the trans. Yes it is smoother and easier on the clutch. But unless you are double clutching the wear and tear on the synchros will be the same, no?

I think the reality is I'm just doing my downshifts at lower rpm. Sorry to get off the subject, back to finding the best fluids!

Unless you "double clutch" on every shift, you're always relying on the synchro's to match the gear speeds. Heel-and-toe is about protecting the clutch and smooth shifting and that's always better, but rev-matching inside the gearbox is still done by synchro's.

You’re both correct...but consider the moments of slight mis-timing like a tad early on the uptake/engagement on the clutch.

If there’s a blip, then the synchro isn’t trying to marry the speeds of the entire drivetrain, engine through the wheels. No blip, and the synchro takes the brunt of the difference.

This is why the Boss clutch not fully disengaging is a huge problem and breaks synchros very quickly.

And yes, I know what double clutching is. I often single-blip-double-clutch if I’m downshifting to 2nd on track and 1st or 2nd on the street. If I lost a synchro I could still keep driving.

 

[therealphee]

Bringing this thread back from the dead. I ran the calimer cocktail for about a year after doing my clutch and recently started experiencing a nibble. Upon reading this thread I switched to the MOTUL and now i’m getting completely locked out of 2nd at high RPM and experiencing 3rd gear nibbles and 5th gear grind when cold.
I want to switch fluids because this is unacceptable on track. What’s the final consensus?

 

[Mad Hatter]

From bitter experience....once you are have serious problems with the gear box. No type of oil will put it back together again. Time for a rebuild or upgrade.

 

[therealphee]

Please keep your truth, logic and reason out of this thread. I came here strictly for lies and encouragement about my MT82. /Sarcasm

 

[bnight]

Amsoil 75w 90 API GL4

Change every other weekend

This is how Steeda #20 car is run it's transmission lasted 3 years of abuse on endurance racing and even won it's class. So it's very good recommendation. However changing trans fluid so often seems extreme.

 

[Scootsmcgreggor]

I think I'm gonna sink some money into a trans cooler as well. Been working for @steveespo so I'm gonna cross my fingers the cooler is the reason for the longevity and its all we need to make MT82's last for years on track. Here's to wishful thinking!

 

[misterpeanut]

Back to the comments about the plastic bushing/bearing... I'd call it a bushing. With a quick search of the interwebs I found this brass bushing solution from Texas Drivetrain Performance

MT82 Bronze Isolator Cup Shift Bushing - Durable Upgrade

Upgrade your 11-17 Ford Mustang MT82 transmission with the Bronze Isolator Cup Shift Bushing. Replaces stock plastic bushing for improved durability and shifting.

txdrivetrain.com

 

[misterpeanut]

With this being an OE transmission, all of the instructions are available in the service manuals. There’s separate files for each subassembly, and the shop manuals provide a list of needed tools for each process. I’ve had good luck sourcing used Rotunda tools for the specialty items, and most of the others are more common tools that don’t need to be Rotunda.

http://iihs.net/fsm/?d=935

I spent a bit of time reading through the MT82 Ford shop manuals this morning. A shop press is needed to remove the counter shaft and the input shaft from the transmission housing. Other than that, it looks like typical press work getting the gears and synchro hubs on and off their respective shafts. They spec a set of snychro puller arms that would make the job easier, but a more common puller may work. The interesting tool is a slide hammer adapter for removing the shift rail detent. Simple little bit, but grossly overpriced because it’s Rotunda.

I think I can also see the problematic plastic bearings that @SavetheManuals was talking about - the 2 bearings that support the output and counter shaft in the mid section of the trans have to be expanded to remove and install from the shaft. Works fine for normal temps I’m sure, but the design leaves little room for performance improvement options.

View attachment 60455

I recently added a 20T press to the garage, and I’m tempted to source the few MT82 specific tools so that I’m set up to work on these. I have a feeling there will be more than a few opportunities to help a fellow track rat out!

This is an excellent resource! Thanks for sharing

 

[steveespo]

I think I'm gonna sink some money into a trans cooler as well. Been working for @steveespo so I'm gonna cross my fingers the cooler is the reason for the longevity and its all we need to make MT82's last for years on track. Here's to wishful thinking!

Absolutely. People will say that is doesn't work, that is not correct either, I can see the temps drop when the pump is on. Also in the end, if you change transmissions, a cooler is a good idea for track use anyway. 11 years on track, 40,000+ miles with 5 different MT-82 transmissions and no failures. Here is a top tip, Ford Clutches are not up to track use. Exedy Hyper Twin is my choice.

 

[therealphee]

Back to the comments about the plastic bushing/bearing... I'd call it a bushing. With a quick search of the interwebs I found this brass bushing solution from Texas Drivetrain Performance

MT82 Bronze Isolator Cup Shift Bushing - Durable Upgrade

Upgrade your 11-17 Ford Mustang MT82 transmission with the Bronze Isolator Cup Shift Bushing. Replaces stock plastic bushing for improved durability and shifting.

txdrivetrain.com

This bushing isn’t what melts. It’s plastic gear sandwiched between the gear sets.

 

[misterpeanut]

Oh, crud I didn't find that.

 

[JeffV8]

I picked up my mt82 from Ben Calimer in November with stage 2 installed this is what he wants me to use.

 

[bnight]

I picked up my mt82 from Ben Calimer in November with stage 2 installed this is what he wants me to use.

This is what steeda use on the Steeda #20 car. But they change very often.

 

[EF1]

I used Redline MTL in my original transaction for years without issue. I went to a Calimer Stage 2 during a clutch replacement since the trans was out. The factory trans was still shifting fine during regular driving but I was getting the dreaded lock out on track and the pedal stuck to the floor a couple of times. Calimer is no longer recommending the "cocktail" due to some trans failures. He is shipping the Amsoil 75-90 that JeffV8 posted above. I am trying it, since he is supposed to know what he is talking about, but I can't imagine it being any better than the Redline MTL that served me well for 8+ years. I am still breaking in the new clutch, so I don't have enough experience with it yet to know.

 

[RES_22]

+1 on the Amsoil.

Another consideration: Wrap the exhaust from manifolds back past the x-pipe. A ton of baseline heat load enters the gearbox from the exhaust under high rpm operation....and also when the thing just sits and absorbs exhaust system heat in the pits.

Yes...we've prolly seen/know someone who has seen a car burn to the ground when an oil soaked wrapped header lit off...can't deny that risk.

I've wrapped my ARH full length with ThermoTec copper+sealant - 4 coats...no regrets (yet lol).

 

[twistedneck]

The biggest problem is when they fail to completely disengage. Particularly at high RPM, and when hot. The Boss 302s seem to have it worst, but they were also the first to get a rev limit of 7,500. I’ve seen it first hand in a Boss clutch that was removed and can see that it has evidence of dragging on one side of the pressure plate.

I suspect later clutches ‘14+ should be ‘better’ in that regard, but it’s hard to say how much so.



Power shifting has a way of showing issues, because of the greater RPM difference that the clutch and trans/synchros are being ‘forced’ to handle. But that’s not the best test for cars with the stock shifter linkage, for the issues that it causes.

...

I’ve said before, even though nobody really likes to hear it, but I still think many problems are caused or exasperated by driver issues or errors. Top of the list is failure to rev match.

My other unpopular opinion is that the MT-82 isn’t particularly fragile internally. I mean I’ve powershifted on track using 305 slicks and frankly more than I should on the street on street tires...and nothing has grenaded, yet. And that’s over 10 years of that in my ‘11 GT.

I know this is an old thread but i am just responding with some info.. speaking with some Pal's back in 2013 or 2014 timeframe.. Rumor had it Ford cost saved on the 5th gear syncro that year.. this resulted in my friend destroying his MT82 in a nearly brand new GT at the time by simply shifting into 5th like a gorilla and ignoring the usual signs that its not warmed up yet.. i.e. its got a little gear bite etc. I think the 5th gear syncro was actually better in the early MT82's..

 

[misterpeanut]

When you guys say "power shift", do you mean you're shifting without using the clutch?

 

[JeffV8]

When you guys say "power shift", do you mean you're shifting without using the clutch?

When I power shift I keep gas pedal to the floor and shift as fast as I can using the clutch.

 

[Mad Hatter]

I blew my 5th gear going up a hill shifting from 4th into 5th with about 5000 miles on the clock in my 2012 Boss. Was a shock as it was not at the track and never have powershifted anything in my life. 5th and 3rd are the first ones to go. I would say that a MT82 is not the best candidate for powershifting.... not even a Calimer stage 3..

 

[JDee]

Even shifting the "normal" way (lift off the gas and depress clutch at the same time), the MT82 is a crap wagon gearbox. Get ready to 1./buy a decent new clutch like an Exedy and 2./do many many rebuilds of the crap wagon MT82. I suggest using Syncrotech parts, they seem to last better than anything else. 3./Above all, find a shop that can even pull the stupid MT82 apart with its pressed in shafts and put it back together. Most can't.
Mach I has a Tremec, what a difference between it and the crap wagon MT82.