Hawk HP plus vs. Raybestos ST 41/43

[2012YellowBoss]

What do you think of me using the Hawk HP plus pads for the track? Remember I am a beginner and don't want to start with the DTC 60 and eat up rotors. They are a bit cheaper then the ST41's.

 

[cloud9]

I would think that is a good option for starting out Scott. Before you do that though, it would be nice to know if the stock pads aren't already very similar to the HP Plus. Have you compared the cost? Since the stock pads are considered acceptable for track use, I'm not sure you'd gain much by switching pads, and if the cost is about the same, I'd just stick with the OEM pad. I would personally recommend DOT 4 fluid though if you haven't already changed it.

 

[2012YellowBoss]

I have not found the stock pads or a cost on them yet? The rotors I have found are
Brembo Sport Slotted Rotors $358 set
Power Slot Power Alloy Cryo-Treated Rotor $106 ea but they don't have fronts
DBA 4000 $820 set of four (hard to find in stock fronts)

Thinking about doing the front in Brembo and the rear in Power Slot with the Hawk HP pads or the Raybestos, Hawks seem to be a lot less.

From what I read I do not even want the DTC60/ht10 at this point, I will most likely bang my head on the wheel, knock myself and then hit the wall then wake up and find out I need new rotors again.

Are the HT10's as tough on the rotors like the 60/70's?

 

[VoodooBoss]

My first time out will be Dot 4 and brake cooling ducts. Everything else will be stock.

 

[VoodooBoss]

Scott, do you have links for the rotors? From my research if I have dedicated track rotors I'll be going with the DTC60 pads front and rear.

 

[BossJockey]

Scott, The HP+ is a good starter pad. There easy on rotors and can handle some heat. The last time I tracked my M3, I use HT10s. They eat into your rotor some but its not like you'll have to replace your rotors every couple of track days. I have 10 track days on my rotors and they are maybe 1/4 to 1/3 worn out.

 

[2012YellowBoss]

Thanks guys, good to know on the 10's. I think the HP plus will work good for me also. I read up on them and ordered a full set.

Rick I got the Brembos slotted up front for 358
http://www.tirerack.com/brakes/brakes.jsp?make=Brembo&model=Sport+Slotted+Rotors&group=Sport+Slotted+Rotor&autoMake=Ford&autoModel=Mustang+Shelby+GT500&autoYear=2011&autoModClar=Coupe

and the rear Power Slot Power Alloy Cryo-Treated Rotor 106 each
http://www.tirerack.com/brakes/brakes.jsp?make=Power+Slot&model=Power+Alloy+Cryo-Treated+Rotor&group=Power+Alloy+Cryo-Treated+Rotor&autoMake=Ford&autoModel=Mustang+Shelby+GT500&autoYear=2011&autoModClar=Coupe

I do not want to step up to the 60/70 till I learn more.

 

[VoodooBoss]

Thanks for the links. So you've already bought them? I thought you weren't going to go wild with track specific wheels and brakes? ;D

 

[cloud9]

It happens to all of us. He's hooked ;D

 

[2012YellowBoss]

I do enjoy it, I bought the Boss since it is a Boss, I am going to the track since I have a Boss (should be my sig). What I am trying to do here is save in the long run and still keep the car looking and running nice and stock for the street. Last think I want is to be running around with worn tires on the street with chipped up rims. One of the guys at tire rack checked into the factory brake setup for me and sent an email

Scott,

I checked with our Brembo rep and he advised me that unfortunately we do not carry or have access to the original equipment parts for the Brembo kit on your Boss. Typically a Ford dealership would be the only means of getting these parts.

Best regards,

That can not be cheap! I still spent a few dollars on this starters kit but I think it will be worth it. everything I bought is still usable on the street even though I will be trailering the car. As time goes on and I understand better I will move up the tire/brake chain.



Others can comment here but from what I read Rick if you use the DTC 60's on the drive to the track you will be running red lights as they will not heat enough for street use. I would also not be real comfortable with NT05's type tire or better on the street, they say street-able but with rain etc. it could be a challenge.

 

[VoodooBoss]

Others can comment here but from what I read Rick if you use the DTC 60's on the drive to the track you will be running red lights as they will not heat enough for street use. I would also not be real comfortable with NT05's type tire or better on the street, they say street-able but with rain etc. it could be a challenge.

Good point on the pads as I don't have a trailer. Like you I'm learning and this is all new to me. I'm also trying to learn from your experiences. ;D Hopefully I'll start learning first hand soon. My first track day will be similar to yours, the car will be stock with the expection of DOT 4 and brake ducts. From there I'll add wheels/tires then brake pads and finally rotors. The tires are a big one as I don't want to burn up the Pirelli's. OTOH they are one of the better street tires for the track. The challenge is finding a good street tire for the track at a reasonable price.

 

[VoodooBoss]

Scott, The HP+ is a good starter pad. There easy on rotors and can handle some heat. The last time I tracked my M3, I use HT10s. They eat into your rotor some but its not like you'll have to replace your rotors every couple of track days. I have 10 track days on my rotors and they are maybe 1/4 to 1/3 worn out.

Were you driving your M3 to and from the track with the HT10's?

 

[2012YellowBoss]

Good point on the pads as I don't have a trailer. Like you I'm learning and this is all new to me. I'm also trying to learn from your experiences. ;D Hopefully I'll start learning first hand soon. My first track day will be similar to yours, the car will be stock with the expection of DOT 4 and brake ducts. From there I'll add wheels/tires then brake pads and finally rotors. The tires are a big one as I don't want to burn up the Pirelli's. OTOH they are one of the better street tires for the track. The challenge is finding a good street tire for the track at a reasonable price.

From what I have found pads like the ST41/43 or the HP+ pads should work for you. I went with rotors also for two reasons, the slotted should help with heat/stopping and eating up the factory rotors can get expensive.

I would have liked to start out with the Nitto 05's for the track but could not get the size I need right now. Since I will be changing out the tires for the track it would have worked well. However the starting on the 555's I think will be just fine, as I said a good learners set and when I replace them with something more for the track I can understand the difference. I will have a better idea and post after I track the 555's so you know.

The car ran just fine stock, what I am doing is just trying to save the factory stuff. If people run 1-2 times a year I doubt they would need anything outside of fluid. I am hoping to get out 5-6 times a years and think in the long run this will save me extra costs while keeping things fresh on the street and the track.

 

[Dean#4AI]

One of the guys at tire rack checked into the factory brake setup for me and sent an email

Scott,

I checked with our Brembo rep and he advised me that unfortunately we do not carry or have access to the original equipment parts for the Brembo kit on your Boss. Typically a Ford dealership would be the only means of getting these parts.

Best regards,

So they are saying they don't have OE rotors but they still have rotors that will fit, correct?

 

[2012YellowBoss]

So they are saying they don't have OE rotors but they still have rotors that will fit, correct?

Yes, Brembo drilled or slotted. I have seen listings for the OE type rotor but never with a price. They also have the DBA 4000 and 5000 that will fit.

 

[VoodooBoss]

It would be nice if we could get a price on the stock rotors but I haven't been able to find it.

 

[cloud9]

Call the dealer.

 

[BossJockey]

Scott, The HP+ is a good starter pad. There easy on rotors and can handle some heat. The last time I tracked my M3, I use HT10s. They eat into your rotor some but its not like you'll have to replace your rotors every couple of track days. I have 10 track days on my rotors and they are maybe 1/4 to 1/3 worn out.

Were you driving your M3 to and from the track with the HT10's?

No, I would swap pads at the track before I got a trailer. I run Hawk HPS pads on the street.

 

[Boss_302]

I should have the Boss this week.

These are my experiences with open tracking and brakes………….

For the past 5 years I have tracked a ’06 GT with the GT500 rotors/calipers, the FR500S ABS Module, the GT500 HCU and the GT500 booster.

The car was basically setup within the SSCA rules for T1, minus the complete cage….back half only.

I used the stock GT500 rotors Ford Part Number 7R3Z-1125-A I could get these from my dealer for about $110 each. These replacement rotors are made by Brembo in Italy. Three to four weekends………….then new ones were needed, don’t worry about little heat stress risers on the surface of the rotors. As long as they don’t go across the top of the rotor from side to side.

For the rear I used the stock rotors made in Brazil, six to eight weekends……..

I started with Hawk HP Pads but didn’t like the fact those pads didn’t like the track heat and would overheat then I would get pad fade.

I stepped up to Carbotech XP12 in front and XP 10 in the back. These are “easy” on the rotors………….

I would get three weekends on a front set and double that for the rears.

Unless you need the couple of extra seconds per lap you would get with a two rotors, say like you are Time Trialing the car, stay with the stock stuff. From a dollar to fun outlook........

The big thing here is to use dedicated rotors with your track pads. If you don’t you will cross contaminate the rotors and not get the benefits from the track pads, i.e. you might run into a problem some call “Ice Mode”.

Some vendors will say you need cross drilled rotors, from experience, I would say no, you won’t get the same life out of the rotors.

Some vendors will say you need slotted rotors, I would say no, modern pads don’t “out gas” like compounds did even 10 years ago.

Just remember to not use the parking brake after a track session, after the session and you park the car roll it about a half tire rotation within about 5 minutes so the heat from the caliper doesn’t sit in one spot to allow the rotor to cool evenly so the rotor doesn’t over heat and crack.

 

[VoodooBoss]

I used the stock GT500 rotors Ford Part Number 7R3Z-1125-A I could get these from my dealer for about $110 each. These replacement rotors are made by Brembo in Italy. Three to four weekends………….then new ones were needed, don’t worry about little heat stress risers on the surface of the rotors. As long as they don’t go across the top of the rotor from side to side.

For the rear I used the stock rotors made in Brazil, six to eight weekends……..

I started with Hawk HP Pads but didn’t like the fact those pads didn’t like the track heat and would overheat then I would get pad fade.

Great info thanks for sharing. Which HP pads did you use? Others have stated the HP+ are good starter pads but the HPS are not.