The Mustang Forum for Track & Racing Enthusiasts

Taking your Mustang to an open track/HPDE event for the first time? Do you race competitively? This forum is for you! Log in to remove most ads.

  • Welcome to the Ford Mustang forum built for owners of the Mustang GT350, BOSS 302, GT500, and all other S550, S197, SN95, Fox Body and older Mustangs set up for open track days, road racing, and/or autocross. Join our forum, interact with others, share your build, and help us strengthen this community!

S550 ITALIAN STANG BUILD :2018 MUSTANG PP1 10 SPEED Build Thread Profile - S550 Mustangs

5,765
6,902
Exp. Type
W2W Racing
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Pleasanton: 1/2 way between Sonoma and Laguna Seca

Dave_W

Cones - not just for ice cream
649
784
Exp. Type
Autocross
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Connecticut
Fuzzy memory from the past, but doesn't CroMoly tubing also need annealing / normalizing around the weld areas to prevent embrittlement or something?
 
132
141
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
San Jose
Fuzzy memory from the past, but doesn't CroMoly tubing also need annealing / normalizing around the weld areas to prevent embrittlement or something?
4130N tubing is used for cages and generally just tig welding with regular er70 filler (mild steel) is acceptable.. Higher strength applications will use higher strength filler but that generally requires some post weld stress relief which for most people is.... Not very practical.

For his weight car you'd have to run .120 wall regardless of tubing, wether its 4130 or regular DOM.. So no weight savings there... under 3000 you can go to .095" 4130 which saves you about .4lbs per foot... That can add up in a cage with 80+ ft of tubing!

Edit: Actually the nasa rules show DOM (mild steel "seamless") and 4130 in the same class so... Really no weight savings anywhere.
 
132
141
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
San Jose
Unfortunately is all about what targets. U want to win? A dct or sequential will be always faster.
(Cause u can also brake with left foot)
Wanna be a "purist"? Manual. That is why i think the option of manual and DCT would have been awesome.
I mean, you can left foot brake with a race manual too. Guys have been doing that for 30 years w dog boxes. Takes some practice to do it right but, that's the simplest and cheapest gearbox option! Road race 4 speed
 
5,765
6,902
Exp. Type
W2W Racing
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Pleasanton: 1/2 way between Sonoma and Laguna Seca
I mean, you can left foot brake with a race manual too. Guys have been doing that for 30 years w dog boxes. Takes some practice to do it right but, that's the simplest and cheapest gearbox option! Road race 4 speed
I'm at that needing a transmission crossroads too....the simplest fix for me is a face plated magnum XL (Dog box) Everything will bolt back up which is nice but they are heavy and I don't need 6 gears. What else is out there in a similar price range that doesn't involve me rebuilding the car to fit or mortgaging my first born male child? You've met Richard...I kinna wanna keep him.


Faceplated magnum XL
 
Take care with the cooling, the Bimmers I run against, go into limp mode all the time with overheated DCT's

I'm at that needing a transmission crossroads too....the simplest fix for me is a face plated magnum XL (Dog box) Everything will bolt back up which is nice but they are heavy and I don't need 6 gears. What else is out there in a similar price range that doesn't involve me rebuilding the car to fit or mortgaging my first born male child? You've met Richard...I kinna wanna keep him.


Faceplated magnum XL
Good guy😀
I'll call u... maybe if we buy 2 we get a discount!
 
132
141
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
San Jose
I'm at that needing a transmission crossroads too....the simplest fix for me is a face plated magnum XL (Dog box) Everything will bolt back up which is nice but they are heavy and I don't need 6 gears. What else is out there in a similar price range that doesn't involve me rebuilding the car to fit or mortgaging my first born male child? You've met Richard...I kinna wanna keep him.


Faceplated magnum XL
You should be able to find used T101A's or jericos for 2,500-3,500. These things were behind the 750hp nascars of the day and the abuse they put them through, they are pretty stout.. Also, they are stupid simple and easy to rebuild too which is nice... You'd just need to find a bellhousing to go coyote to muncie pattern.... I am pretty sure vernier bell makes one for this, I haven't really searched it out that much though. Then you'd need a regular slip yoke style driveline which should be pretty easy

Pro driver with a race box:

Keep in mind, you really also need a low MOI clutch setup like a tilton to really be able to downshift like that. The engine needs to spin up very quickly to be able to do the quick blips. But you can see he is just left foot braking and throttle blipping the whole time.

Edit: looks like quicktime makes one : https://pbhperformance.com/product/quicktime-bellhousing-for-coyote-swap/
 
Last edited:
910
1,446
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
SoCal
I'm at that needing a transmission crossroads too....the simplest fix for me is a face plated magnum XL (Dog box) Everything will bolt back up which is nice but they are heavy and I don't need 6 gears. What else is out there in a similar price range that doesn't involve me rebuilding the car to fit or mortgaging my first born male child? You've met Richard...I kinna wanna keep him.


Faceplated magnum XL
Or how bout an 80# 5 speed Jerico setup for road race? Huge weight savings w/dog rings. No idea on cost though - would have to call them and talk through it


31696191-12AE-4B04-9109-29EE34E36F89.png

https://www.jericoperformance.com/5speed.html
 
132
141
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
San Jose
I'm at that needing a transmission crossroads too....the simplest fix for me is a face plated magnum XL (Dog box) Everything will bolt back up which is nice but they are heavy and I don't need 6 gears. What else is out there in a similar price range that doesn't involve me rebuilding the car to fit or mortgaging my first born male child? You've met Richard...I kinna wanna keep him.


Faceplated magnum XL
Let's do it I might have another box available with road race ratios... With your rpm it would be an 80+mph first gear lol. Taking off might be a pain , just do a burnout to warm the tires up like you do anyways lol.
 
5,765
6,902
Exp. Type
W2W Racing
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Pleasanton: 1/2 way between Sonoma and Laguna Seca
Let's do it I might have another box available with road race ratios... With your rpm it would be an 80+mph first gear lol. Taking off might be a pain , just do a burnout to warm the tires up like you do anyways lol.
Here are my concerns....something that will fit in my tunnel without cutting. Now that the car is completed its a lot tougher to mod things without upsetting other things or climbing over door bars, re routing electrical etc. Currently the shifter comes out right behind my switch panel. A shorter trans will mean a new hole and re thinking that switch panel/electrical arrangement. There isn't a great place for it which is how it ended up where it did. I do have a slip yolk drive shaft already and could have that extended and I can deal with making a cross member. I'd need something with a 1:30 third gear. Any lower and I run out of steam and any higher and it wont pull off the corners. I only get away with this heavy car/low HP motor because the gearing is perfect for the tracks we run. The easy button is a modified Magnum XL but they are so heavy. s1sequential just sent me their new improved fancy pants shifter w/upgrades and that will only work on the magnum. A smaller clutch...I wonder what the minimum would be...mine is lighter than stock but its not a 5" multi plate or anything....that's a chunk of change right there. I also have a super limited budget.....like in terms of money......we have no money. lol. How much more money do I put into an obsolete car to race for no prize money? Meanwhile, the kids of the guys I used to race late models with are racing for 10k to win locally....10K to win...and they're kids! So much for me to think about....

277526955_345799694182154_1679279477166101779_n.jpg
 
Last edited:
5,157
6,084
Kids..
Always trying to reinvent the wheel..

He then started Doug Nash Equipment and Engineering (DNEE) in Detroit to offer prototype work for the hometown car manufacturers and to develop the Doug Nash 4+1 and 5-speed racing transmissions. The highly successful transmissions featured a torsion bar that absorbed shocks from torque and fast shifting. The company moved to Tennessee in 1976, and was eventually purchased by Richmond Gear.
 
5,765
6,902
Exp. Type
W2W Racing
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Pleasanton: 1/2 way between Sonoma and Laguna Seca
The Face Plated TKX looks really good, and cheaper than the Magnum at half the weight.


TKX.JPG
TKX stats.JPG
The shifter is 9" farther forward than the Magnum XL....that would take some fancy linkage or a long goofy shift lever to get there....but its possible.
 
Last edited:

Dave_W

Cones - not just for ice cream
649
784
Exp. Type
Autocross
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Connecticut
Random googling found a post that said G-Force (who bought Tex) may have used rebuilt units if you call them, and can install the ratios you want in a used box before they ship it. Also, the 101 and 101A parts may not completely interchangeable, so keep that in mind when looking at used boxes.

Looks like S1 makes a sequential to fit the G-Force/Tex & Jerico

Replacing a TKO with a T-101A in an early Mustang - gives you an idea of shifter location difference
 
132
141
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
San Jose
Random googling found a post that said G-Force (who bought Tex) may have used rebuilt units if you call them, and can install the ratios you want in a used box before they ship it. Also, the 101 and 101A parts may not completely interchangeable, so keep that in mind when looking at used boxes.

Looks like S1 makes a sequential to fit the G-Force/Tex & Jerico

Replacing a TKO with a T-101A in an early Mustang - gives you an idea of shifter location difference
The T101/101A are pretty similar. The main difference is the 101a use a "cuff" that ties the main and countershaft together with two bearings. So the 101A is generally the box that people try and buy because its stronger but, behind a coyote I doubt there would be any problems with either box..

I have a spare T101 box laying around, it "may" be sold but I have heard that for almost 2 years now. If my buddy doesn't want it, it would go good in someone's race car ... :) Ratios are 1.88, 1.54 ,1.24 , 1:1

Shifter location is sort of a moot point, you can build a plate and set the shifter wherever you want on any of those race 4 speeds.
 
Last edited:
The T101/101A are pretty similar. The main difference is the 101a use a "cuff" that ties the main and countershaft together with two bearings. So the 101A is generally the box that people try and buy because its stronger but, behind a coyote I doubt there would be any problems with either box..

I have a spare T101 box laying around, it "may" be sold but I have heard that for almost 2 years now. If my buddy doesn't want it, it would go good in someone's race car ... :) Ratios are 1.88, 1.54 ,1.24 , 1:1

Shifter location is sort of a moot point, you can build a plate and set the shifter wherever you want on any of those race 4 speeds.
If no one else is interested - I am. Got a kit car coming that sure would be sweet with a good 4 speed
 

TMO Supporting Vendors

Latest posts

Buy TMO Apparel

Buy TMO Apparel
Top