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Removing the Stock Oil Cooler, what is needed?

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302 Hi Pro

Boss 302 - Racing Legend to Modern Muscle Car
2,009
441
Southeast
I have been reading with interest about some of your reported engine oil temps and locations of temperature sending units. This started me thinking that matching the correct size oil cooler is most important to maintain proper oil temps. If the oil is running too cool, then the combustion by- products contaminants will not burn off, and if the oil bearing temps run too high, 375 plus degrees, bearing failure, overheated.

It made me begin to think (and this is only my thoughts on the matter), of the importance of selecting the proper size cooler for use in my Boss, which is used mostly on the street. Engine oil temps vary greatly through the engine and I believe two points are crankshaft bearing/journals and oil pan temps. These points represent the highest and lowest temp ranges on engines without coolers. Most critical temps are main and rod temps, and the relationship of these temps to oil pan oil temps. There could be a 75 degree (or more) temp difference between oil pan and bearing temps.

Look at this chart: http://performanceunlimited.com/documents/tempguide.html

Where to place oil temp sending unit? Before or after the external cooler?

Oil path comes up from the pan, through the pump, now pressurized, to the oil filter. Enters the outside circular row of holes on the filter and to the main oil galley from the center hole of the filter. Also Boss 302 water/oil cooler. Clean and cooled, (or heated oil, no joking) then enters the main oil galley and is first delivered to the crankshaft. After this, oil is directed, up to cylinder heads, cams, chain tensioners, rockers, etc. and the oil returns in each bank cylinder heads.

As oil moves through each lubrication point, a certain percent is subject to bleed off and returns to pan as well. Each oil galley off of the main galley will deliver oil to the above locations.

Stress point is the crankshaft and highest temp load is here. How hot is to hot? The chart suggest bearing destruction at oil temps above 375 degrees. Best oil temp sunset location is the oil pan readings, best operating temps 270 degrees. Or the range would be 250 to 270 degrees.

So if you are reading 250 to 270 degrees before the cooler, then keep in mind the oil is then directed from the sandwich plate through the filter then directly to the main oil galley, then crank bearings first, the secondary oil galleys and on to the Camshafts, etc. Also the oil pump will raise oil temps over oil pan temps and as oil is delivered to to the filter, the sandwich plate, directs it to the external, oil cooler then thru the filter.

Should I use a T-Stat?. The Boss OEM oil cooler actually acts as an oil heater when the engine is cold. Coolant temps raise to normal operating temps much quicker than oil temps, so when the coolant is at temp of 200 - 210 degrees, it does warm the cooler oil temps quicker. A good thing as the most stress on an engine is on cold start up and high loads on a cold engine. Do not rev a cold engine.

I have come to learn that a T-stat is very important when removing the Boss water/oil cooler and running a only the air/oil cooler.

So now after rethinking this and the importance of maintains proper oil temps, I will use the same size and spec components that FRPP offers in their optional external oil cooler. Now that is for my application as I am not a dedicated race car driver as many of you are, and your oil cooler decisions are based on a completely different conditions and application. But if your Boss is not a dedicated Race car, then we have a lot to think about before we install an external cooler. For street applications, bigger may not be better.

Sorry if I rambled on there, but I think this is a most important topic and it now believe that application/use is an important component of cooler size selection.

Thanks again for your consideration and I appreciate you comments and thoughts on my assessment of the engine lubrication system.
302 Hi Pro
 

576

For those of you running an air to oil cooler without the Boss water to oil cooler what type of oil pressure readings do you see? Rough numbers cold and hot. I just finished my oil to air cooler install with the elimination of the stock cooler. My setup is Mishimoto thermostatic plate, 934 cooler, -10 braided lines. The plate has 2 ports. I am using the return (out of the cooler) 1/8" port for temp. and out (into the cooler) 1/8" port for pressure. Length of line into the cooler is approx. 2ft. Length of line out of the cooler is approx. 3ft. I mounted the cooler with inlet bottom exit top. This worked out for the space available. 1st start up from dead cold, pressure was 25-30 psi idle and 90-100 psi 2500 rpm. Temperature with these readings was below 140 F. Took roughly 20 minutes to see above 180 F with ambient approx. 70 F. Once the temperature came up the pressure readings lowered somewhat. I'm thinking the location of the pressure sender at the plate is causing an elevated reading. Or maybe not? Can't seem to find any Ford specs. Thanks for any info.
 

ArizonaBOSS

Because racecar.
Moderator
8,730
2,734
Arizona, USA
Cold start: 95ish
Warm idle: 55ish
Operating: up to 85ish
Hot track exit idle: 20ish or slightly less (I try to leave it in-gear and loaded until I park)
 

576

Thanks AZBoss. Seems to be same temps/ pressures I'm seeing. Are you in AZ? I spent about 10 years in Scottsdale/ Chandler. My parents are still out in Tucson. Kind of miss the wide open space. Not the heat though!
 
ArizonaBOSS said:
Cold start: 95ish
Warm idle: 55ish
Operating: up to 85ish
Hot track exit idle: 20ish or slightly less (I try to leave it in-gear and loaded until I park)

Was at a lower sustained rpm track today and didn't see oil temp above 260* in spite of warmer ambient temp -- 74*

Diff peaked at 220*

Cold Start: 100+
High rpm operating: 95
Track exit 32-38
 

576

Thanks again for the info. Although I have no idea what pressures/ temps. were with the stock cooler only, I will say driving on the street it takes a good 15-20 minutes for my oil temp. to get past 180 F. Like I said though, I have the temp. sensor mounted to the exit side of the cooler. This is in 65-70 F ambient. Should work good once summer temps. come around and for my next track day in May at Sonoma. Black Boss, I am curious on your diff. cooler setup. Did you add this due to a failure or as a preventive measure? Also, I would imagine there is some extra heat back in the spare tire area with this setup. I remember the first track day I did and noticing the spare tire area (metal) was significantly hot to the touch (exhaust on my car is stock). Seems like your use is mainly track so any additional cooling in any system would help in the longevity of the components.
 
576 said:
Black Boss, I am curious on your diff. cooler setup. Did you add this due to a failure or as a preventive measure? Also, I would imagine there is some extra heat back in the spare tire area with this setup. I remember the first track day I did and noticing the spare tire area (metal) was significantly hot to the touch (exhaust on my car is stock). Seems like your use is mainly track so any additional cooling in any system would help in the longevity of the components.

I did it after talking to both Dean at Rehagen and the Ford Racing guys on the Watson tour, for longevity. Some of the groups I run with do 30 minute sessions. Seemed like good insurance, especially given that I'm seeing 220* after 20 minutes at low ambients.......
 
Anyone know the Ford part number for the short threaded filter adapter that replaces the long one that is used to hold cooler to block? This would be the part/adapter that threads into the block in the center of the filter housing and the filter would then thread onto this threaded adapter.
 

576

Looked through my receipts. Just fininshed my cooler install. Should be AL3Z-6890-A for the standard adaptor (Ford lists it as an "Insert") that will then allow a plate to hook up. I think earlier in this thread the part number is listed as well.
 
576 said:
Looked through my receipts. Just fininshed my cooler install. Should be AL3Z-6890-A for the standard adaptor (Ford lists it as an "Insert") that will then allow a plate to hook up. I think earlier in this thread the part number is listed as well.

Thanks!
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
576 said:
Looked through my receipts. Just fininshed my cooler install. Should be AL3Z-6890-A for the standard adaptor (Ford lists it as an "Insert") that will then allow a plate to hook up. I think earlier in this thread the part number is listed as well.

Steve has it in reply #2. Needs to go in the the first post, Rick! ;)
 

576

A little info. on the oil temps. I'm seeing with the 934 cooler installed, no stock cooler and a lower air duct directing air behind the bumper to the cooler face: Ambient high 40's F. After 20 minutes of 70-75 mph, temp. finally got to 180 F or so. Ambient high 70's F. After 20 minutes of 70-75 mph right around 195 F. Same ambients with the air duct blocked. 180 F within 5 minutes street driving. 200-210 F at end of same 20 minute drive. This is all at "Normal" rpm. I have the temp. sensor mounted outlet of the cooler. Honestly, if I did it again I might use a smaller cooler for my use. I'm sure for my few track days a year this will do the job. I did not expect the small air duct I made to make such a difference. I guess the next question might be what are the temps. going into to the cooler? Anyway, my opinion at this point is, unless you track your car a lot, keep the stock cooler. Its hella cheaper to replace that than build a dedicated system. Although it was fun getting everything together.
 

steveespo

Lord knows I'm a Voodoo Child
Moderator
4,008
1,924
Exp. Type
W2W Racing
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
Cookeville TN
Max Temps I saw at Charlotte running 20 minute sessions using 7200 rpm shift points with 7400 used in 3rd gear over run braking for infield turn 5.
Engine oil Motul 300V Racing 15w50. Max temp with Setrab 934 matrix and Improved racing 180 thermostatic block mounted with Ford Racing bracket in stock position and no water to oil cooler assembly was 235 degrees max during 70 degree ambient day. Car ran at or close to WOT in 5th gear from NASCAR turn 2 all the way back to the start finish line, about 1 mile. I am happy with the results and am glad to have removed the potential fail point from the system. Oil pressure was between 72 and 79 psi above 3000 rpm.
Steve
 

steveespo

Lord knows I'm a Voodoo Child
Moderator
4,008
1,924
Exp. Type
W2W Racing
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
Cookeville TN
Grant 302 said:
Great info Steve. Been looking forward to your update. Are you still running the piston squirters?

Shhhh! Top secret anti overheating fix. Yes long block is still stock '11 5.0. Surprisingly the highest peak temperature on the transmission was 220 degrees. Mostly ran 180-200 so that made me feel better about fluid lifespan there.
I got killed in the 'A' group in the infield from Turn 3 to Turn 8, once on the banking I was pulling in cars 100 yards away and could run the white line through NASCAR 3&4 like nobody's business. I told everyone that the 21 car didn't know much about turning right at Charlotte, but knew its' way around the Tri Oval like David Pearson was driving.
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
Nice, and thanks. I gotta stop sharing the GT secrets...like our air dam. :-X ;) I like that my primary track car has the squirters. Unfortunately, it does mean that we probably need to cool the oil even more, since the oil is cooling the engine directly.

My car still sees mostly street time so I'm gong to keep the stock cooler/heater and probably going to piggy back a 925 without a t-stat and partly block the cooler when I'm not on track.
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
HackBoss302 said:
After hearing about a friend of mines Aeroquip push-loc hose failure I'm considering having steel braided hoses made or using these from Mishimoto when I build my kit in May. Anyone have a better suggestion? These are somewhat pricey.
http://www.mishimoto.com/3ft-stainless-steel-braided-hose-w--10an-fittings.html

Just noticed that these are available from summit drop shipped (presumably from Mishimoto) for 3ft/$52.50, 4ft/$60.00 also available in 5 and 6 ft.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mio-mmsbh-10-3
http://www.summitracing.com/search/brand/mishimoto/product-line/mishimoto-stainless-steel-braided-hoses?autoview=SKU
 
I was looking at those on Mishimoto's site. The question is how long do we need?
 
Ok, so I finally have my oil cooler installed. Some pics with some notes. First, the Mishimoto thermostatic plate is nice, but not that nice. The oil gasket just fits the oil gasket surface on the block. They should have made it a little bit bigger in diameter. Second, they drilled and tapped the 1/8 pipe holes to close to the inlet and outlet. When I install my sender in their hole, it blocked most of the outlet opening. I had to redrill the plate with a hole a little closer to the middle of the plate so my temp sending unit did not block of the outlet. I want my temps taken where the oil is flowing out of the block to the cooler. See pic below of new sender location.

5x5j.jpg
 
Now for the installation of the lines to the cooler. After really looking for the best location to run the lines, I decided to run the line from the plate, across in front of the steering rack and out the front to the cooler. I ended up with one line at 4' and the other at 5' ( I know, a little long). I used 45 degree fittings at the plate and 90 degree fittings at the cooler. The line and fittings are 10AN. I also used a few feet of 3/4" plastic wire loom (for extra protection) and 2 - 3/4 rubber covered clamps and a few zip ties. The location of the clamps worked out perfect. I used the existing screw that holds the lower part of the PCM bracket. The hoses are not near any sharp edges.

Pic of filter, plate and fittings. Note red colored front sway bar.

xomk.jpg


45 degree fittings attached to Mishimoto plate

yse6.jpg


Hoses running along front of steering rack.

08td.jpg


Hoses headed up from steering rack.

9hz0e.jpg


Hoses going up to PCM screw location. Note that the hose is resting against foam insulation on AC line.

dn1k.jpg


View of hoses coming forward from PCM screw location and then connecting to cooler

0qq2.jpg


Picture of clamps in lower PCM screw location

izn0.jpg


Front view.

bmk5.jpg


Front view with rubber shroud installed. Could have done a little better with the cut

ng6z.jpg
 

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