The Times They Are A-Charging

[TMSBOSS]

Too many cars/drivers need range above 300 miles for this to happen any time soon.

 

[VoodooBoss]

It's a really liberating thing not going to a gas station and instead "refueling" in your garage. Between my wife and I we made on average 10 fill ups a month. Now with me retiring and buying the Tesla that's down to 1-2 trips a month. With all of our vehicles using premium at $3.99 a gallon locally that's a big savings. Only downside is having to clean windshields at home. I estimate we're spending an additional $30-40 a month on electricity.

 

[VoodooBoss]

Too many cars/drivers need range above 300 miles for this to happen any time soon.

Define "too many"? That's not an issue in urban/suburban areas. Here in CA a lot of people are interested in buying them. Once the cost gets a bit lower you'll see even more on the road. When I had my Tesla at a service center last week I was talking to a mechanic and he said they haven't done many brake jobs but they had just completed a brake job on a customers Model S at 150,000 miles, that was the first brake job on that car. The maintenance on an EV is going to be a lot less too. Not saying they are perfect but don't knock it until you've driven one for a few days and really get to understand the different driving dynamics. @Fat Boss

 

[TMSBOSS]

Everyone where I live. You know, the fly over states. Places not California with people living on top of people. People that have to travel over 125 miles each way to visit family. People that are not subsidized or encentivizes by the government to drive a type of vehicle. HOV lanes, I have to explain these to my neighbors. Why, they have lived their entire lives away from big cities and all their charm.
While not trying to, you demonstrated the great divide in our nation today. Folks only seeing how they live, caring only for those who live the same way. Hell, I will be driving 450 miles simply to return to my other home to vote. A Tesla won’t even get me to the state I vote in let alone to my home.
I have said it before. Until battery technology improves, the Tesla/electric cars will be Limited to urban centers. I believe you can’t drive a Tesla north to south in Illinois, let alone Cali without stopping to recharge. I can refuel in less time than it takes to order a burger. Time to charge on a Tesla, 4-8 hours?
So to answer your question. About half of the nations population have zero use for Electric car. Make a better battery/mouse trap and the numbers will change. Not sure how driving a car for a few days will make it useful. The tech is simply not there yet.

 

[The_Dead_Cow]

You may not be able to go ALL the way across Illinois but you could get close (without a charge). Notice the supercharging stations that you would drive by on your way south/north. If you stopped and ate lunch, the supercharger could have your battery at 75% in ~30 min to complete the trip.

Currently EV's seem like a pretty good option for daily driving under ~300mi (Tesla's) IMO. I live in a multi-car household and my daily rarely sees 150mi/day, if more range is needed I'd take a different car. Although if I were regularly driving +300mi/day, EV's wouldn't really be an option. It's all relative to your immediate needs.

Everyone where I live. You know, the fly over states. Places not California with people living on top of people. People that have to travel over 125 miles each way to visit family. People that are not subsidized or encentivizes by the government to drive a type of vehicle. HOV lanes, I have to explain these to my neighbors. Why, they have lived their entire lives away from big cities and all their charm.
While not trying to, you demonstrated the great divide in our nation today. Folks only seeing how they live, caring only for those who live the same way. Hell, I will be driving 450 miles simply to return to my other home to vote. A Tesla won’t even get me to the state I vote in let alone to my home.
I have said it before. Until battery technology improves, the Tesla/electric cars will be Limited to urban centers. I believe you can’t drive a Tesla north to south in Illinois, let alone Cali without stopping to recharge. I can refuel in less time than it takes to order a burger. Time to charge on a Tesla, 4-8 hours?
So to answer your question. About half of the nations population have zero use for Electric car. Make a better battery/mouse trap and the numbers will change. Not sure how driving a car for a few days will make it useful. The tech is simply not there yet.

 

[302BOB]

we're spending an additional $30-40 a month on electricity.

Do the batteries stay charged if the car sits for a week or two?...$30-$40 a month is a little more than what I pay for gas for the Boss & truck, but I'm retired and don't go out everyday.I'm sure riding by a gas station and not having to stop will make you smile.

 

[VoodooBoss]

Were going to have to agree to disagree. I still contend that a 300 mile range is doable the the vast majority of drivers in the US, maybe 80% or more. Doesn't look like the average daily commute for Illinois residents is much different from anywhere else in the US. There will always be exceptions for long trips. As always all discussions on TMO should avoid politics but just to be clear I usually vote red and this is not an environmental discussion for me. The Tesla purchase was for my wife and I expected to be underwhelmed with it but the exact opposite happened. You gotta wonder why Ford and all major car manufacturers are scrambling to develop and sell EV's?

I saw on the news this morning the average car sold in the US now costs $35K. The Chevy Bolt starts at $36K with a 238 mile range before tax incentives.

And FWIW there is no way I'd buy Tesla stock.

You can check average daily commutes by state/county at the link below.
https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/united-states/quick-facts/illinois/average-commute-time#map

 

[VoodooBoss]

Do the batteries stay charged if the car sits for a week or two?...$30-$40 a month is a little more than what I pay for gas for the Boss & truck, but I'm retired and don't go out everyday.I'm sure riding by a gas station and not having to stop will make you smile.

The battery stays charged but there is "vampire drain" of the battery of 2-3 miles a day. That $30-40 a month is driving the car about 1,400 each month so far which is about the same as the 4-5 fill ups in our Ford Fusion that my wife commuted in.

 

[302BOB]

about 1,400 each month

I don't drive that much in 6 mos!!!..So you must be doing great!!....When I first got the Boss, it was a different story, tho...

 

[TymeSlayer]

What kind of strain will it put on our electric power grid when half the population is driving electric cars? And what will that do to the cost of electricity and in turn, how much Rick is paying per month to power up his batteries when that demand becomes so great? "They" will still exact their pound of flesh one way or another.

 

[VoodooBoss]

Those are certainly issues that will need to be addressed and need addressing regardless of how many EV’s are on the road. In the meantime the city I live in owns it’s own gas fired power plant and solar farm and we have one of the lowest electric rates in CA with 9.5 cents per KWH.

 

[302BOB]

"They" will always find a way to make you pay no matter what you drive. EV technology and support has a long way to go before we see a major impact to our lifestyles. But hints and questions of this impact are already starting to surface.

 

[302BOB]

9.5 cents per KWH.

I 've been looking at may latest electric bill and can't find a KWH figure. They got all kind of other stuff on there. My monthly bill is around $100. Is that close to CA Prices, without the added EV charging expense?

 

[VoodooBoss]

In a quick search I found the prices below. Mine jumps to 13.5 cents per kWh during peak periods which mainly apply when I’m running our AC 8 or more hours a day during the summer.

Then there’s this.

https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.php?t=epmt_5_6_a

 

[TMSBOSS]

If I want to park the EV and buy a second/other car for when I drive a distance, great. Ignorant but great. Take a road trip, I need a different car. Want to go to a NASCAR race, need a different car.
“Average daily commute “ for urban, suburban folks likely. Not for the folks who live on land with a well. A trip to the Mall involves at least one tank of gas, nope. No one I know, neighbors, family friends see an EV as a possible choice for transport. Cost aside, they just don’t meet the needs for rural Americans.
Curious how popular EVs will be when the state and local governments start charging road taxes for EVs. Do you pay road taxes on the electricity you use? When HOV lanes again require high occupancy. When the playing field is level.
Without a change in technology, utility the EV is still a toy for many

 

[VoodooBoss]

I don’t make the rules but I try and take advantage of them when I can. I do expect CA will follow IL in the move to mileage based road taxes. It’s coming soon.

 

[TMSBOSS]

I do like the incentive the current system placed on fuel mileage when it comes to road taxes. Will this continue with mileage based systems, not likely. The ability to “Tank Up” your EV during low demand hours also a great idea.
Instant torque, what is there not to love?

 

[302BOB]

Instant torque, what is there not to love?

Nothing I can think of, except that rush I get opening my Boss up.I've never been in a EV to compare the torque difference/experience between the two............I've heard the quietness of the EV takes some getting used to...

 

[Fat Boss]

What kind of strain will it put on our electric power grid when half the population is driving electric cars? And what will that do to the cost of electricity and in turn, how much Rick is paying per month to power up his batteries when that demand becomes so great? "They" will still exact their pound of flesh one way or another.

The bulk of the power grid is optimized for afternoon AC use in the summer. The bulk of electric cars are designed to be programmable to charge overnight in the well-off-peak hours. This fact makes the transition to EV's pretty easy from a grid standpoint. Additionally, there is a lot of talk of using EV's that are charged at night to augment the grid during high demand periods. It adds flexibility to the grid.

If I want to park the EV and buy a second/other car for when I drive a distance, great. Ignorant but great. Take a road trip, I need a different car. Want to go to a NASCAR race, need a different car.
“Average daily commute “ for urban, suburban folks likely. Not for the folks who live on land with a well. A trip to the Mall involves at least one tank of gas, nope. No one I know, neighbors, family friends see an EV as a possible choice for transport. Cost aside, they just don’t meet the needs for rural Americans.
Curious how popular EVs will be when the state and local governments start charging road taxes for EVs. Do you pay road taxes on the electricity you use? When HOV lanes again require high occupancy. When the playing field is level.
Without a change in technology, utility the EV is still a toy for many

You only have one vehicle? Pretty rich to call it ignorant to have more than one. I have 4 and they're for VERY different applications. EV to drive to work and back, Turbo Diesel 4x4 Crew Cab with 6 Speed for hauling stuff/vol fire stuff, Shelby for fun, and my old Falcon for nostalgia. Oh, and I have a well. I don't think anyone is marketing a Tesla or Focus EV or any other electric for rural buyers. Are they? I don't pay road taxes on electricity. Electricity is a form of fuel, not a measure of distance. It's hard to say what I'll do when the time comes for high occupancy requirements. For now, I play the game. I just made it the 29 miles to work in 27 minutes, and that includes some country roads. If I drove the Shelby or Truck it'd take at least another 15 minutes in the morning and 30 in the afternoon, so I play the game. My time is worth money to me and the time saved more than pays for the car each month. And some people for sure think their EV's are toys, but 99% drive them to work.

I don’t make the rules but I try and take advantage of them when I can. I do expect CA will follow IL in the move to mileage based road taxes. It’s coming soon.

I think that'll be a net positive for those of us with multiple cars. My dad pays registrations for his 7 or 8 old cars, so going to mileage based reg will certainly be good for him. Right now he's taxed as if he drives his 1910 Model T or 32 Duece Coupe on a daily basis.

 

[Grant 302]

The bulk of the power grid is optimized for afternoon AC use in the summer. The bulk of electric cars are designed to be programmable to charge overnight in the well-off-peak hours. This fact makes the transition to EV's pretty easy from a grid standpoint. Additionally, there is a lot of talk of using EV's that are charged at night to augment the grid during high demand periods. It adds flexibility to the grid.

This. And if (or when) everyone is driving them, solar charging durning the day will also make a lot of sense. Would be a good excuse for employers to have solar carports here. I'd run separate panels if need be on the house. I'm surprised they aren't built into car roofs and upper surfaces already.