The Mustang Forum for Track & Racing Enthusiasts

Taking your Mustang to an open track/HPDE event for the first time? Do you race competitively? This forum is for you! Log in to remove most ads.

  • Welcome to the Ford Mustang forum built for owners of the Mustang GT350, BOSS 302, GT500, and all other S550, S197, SN95, Fox Body and older Mustangs set up for open track days, road racing, and/or autocross. Join our forum, interact with others, share your build, and help us strengthen this community!

S197 Transformation of Sweet Lorraine Build Thread Profile - S197 Mustangs

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

302 Hi Pro

Boss 302 - Racing Legend to Modern Muscle Car
2,009
441
Southeast
It reads to me as: The mini starter is a non-production unit that comes with new cables to accommodate the install of the new fender well diode assembly?

I also get the feeling that a few have installed the mini starter without the diode.

What is the Forum consensus? Tyme needs our help, let’s get him back on the track ASAP.
 

302 Hi Pro

Boss 302 - Racing Legend to Modern Muscle Car
2,009
441
Southeast
Since push starting didn't work, I don't understand why replacing the starter would make any difference.

First, I have always advocated to pull the wiring connections to the starter for inspection. It was some 5-6 years ago that I installed headers (K-Member) dropped) and I found one OEM connection hanging by a Thread or Two. I thought it may have been a ground at that location, but it also may have been to the solenoid. Can’t remember exactly but it was in the starter wiring group of wires.

My Boss was built 3rd week of October 2011, number 2800 and I think Sweet Lorraine was built near this time frame. On my Boss, (Miss Kona), it was clearly a OEM connection that was improperly made & not a 3 quarter broken wire from use.

Heat will defiantly affect a poor wiring connection, and Heat will definitely affect an internal short in the Solenoid. When hot the internal coil pack could expand to create a short to ground. As the starter motor is directly tied to the battery & alternator, this could cause a dead ignition system.

Other than this, I’m at a loss for other solutions. Tyme will tell (us).
 
Tyme's (Sweet Lorraine's) troubles have got to be a loose wire, frayed wire or some kind of other wire (short) that doesn't like heat...starters and batterys are not going to fix this..if this was a common problem, someone would have encountered it already....Tyme is on his own here........................
 
In the write up on Summit, it says:
"Ford Performance Parts mini high-torque starters are a great addition to your car. They feature a high-output motor with internal gear reduction that provides more cranking power than stock, yet is 30 percent smaller. Their smaller size brings the weight down 5 lbs. from OE starters and provides a great deal more header clearance. These are the perfect starters for vehicles with high-compression engines and tight-fitting headers. Instructions and special battery cables are included, but you must use a firewall solenoid."

What's it mean to use a firewall soleniod? Isn't it attached to the starter?

That's for a non OEM vehicle, I didn't have to do anything special to install this starter.
 

TymeSlayer

Tramps like us, Baby we were born to run...
3,787
2,740
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
Brighton, Colorado
A guy I know tells me he had this type of problem with his Camaro. He would hit the starter with a hammer and it would shake things up and most of the tyme it would start. Now I just love taking a hammer to things that don't cooperate but I'll try a little finesse with the new FP mini starter and see if this works. Hope to throw it in this weekend.
 

302 Hi Pro

Boss 302 - Racing Legend to Modern Muscle Car
2,009
441
Southeast
A guy I know tells me he had this type of problem with his Camaro. He would hit the starter with a hammer and it would shake things up and most of the tyme it would start. Now I just love taking a hammer to things that don't cooperate but I'll try a little finesse with the new FP mini starter and see if this works. Hope to throw it in this weekend.

Kirk:

This very well may work out for you as when internal starter components get hot, things like the stator can swell & ground out against the inner starter housing.

I’ve seen this happen before on my 71 914/6 2.0l. Couldn’t even push start it till it cooled down.

So hoping this works for you. But troubleshooting electrical issues over the internet with out a multimeter is a crap shoot at best.

Good luck & hoping this solves your issue. I can only imagine how frustrating this must be especially when you loose precious track tyme.
 

TMSBOSS

Spending my pension on car parts and track fees.
7,530
5,248
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
Illinois
A guy I know tells me he had this type of problem with his Camaro. He would hit the starter with a hammer and it would shake things up
The Chevy MK-IV big blocks were the same way.
But troubleshooting electrical issues over the internet with out a multimeter is a crap shoot at best.
The cost of a light weight starter is likely the best/easiest path. Without a multimeter. Great Advice!!
 

TymeSlayer

Tramps like us, Baby we were born to run...
3,787
2,740
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
Brighton, Colorado
Installed the new FRPP mini starter on Saturday with no issues although as someone mentioned, there is that one bolt that wasn't easy off or easy on. I sheilded the entire starter motor with DEI wrap and replaced the possitve battery cable fuse as well. While under there I checked all the wiring and connections and everything looked fine. I had previously changed out all the relays and the starter relay fuse.

A comparrison of the two starter motors:
Engine Bay (344).jpg
The Battery cable fuse:
Engine Bay (349).jpg

I had high hopes as the car started right up with the temps at about 92 degrees. But as I drove the car around the neighborhood for about five minutes, the dash lit up as it has been doing all along. The car did not shut down on me while driving but I had no reading on the gauges and the same messages. Threw a code reader on it and no codes. The search for the gremlin continues...
 

Dave_W

Cones - not just for ice cream
986
1,278
Exp. Type
Autocross
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Connecticut
Would it help to add some external heat sink blocks to dissipate heat off the starter?

If the starter isn't hotter than the surrounding air, then they're "sinking" heat into the starter. You typically want to insulate the starter from the hotter headers, from both convection and radiation, by using a blanket with shiny exterior.
 

TymeSlayer

Tramps like us, Baby we were born to run...
3,787
2,740
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
Brighton, Colorado
I had been busy putting on a charity golf outing and five days camping in the mountains the past few weeks andhaven't had much tyme with the car. The problem still persists and to be honest, I'm not sure what my next step will be. We're getting snow here these past two days and that hasn't help. The search for the gremlin continues. BTW, I did wrap the starter completely in shielding and that didn't help.
 

TMO Supporting Vendors

Top