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Riots in DC

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We have plenty of military veterans on this Forum and though I am just a military brat , I happened to be in my formative years in Germany when the Berlin Wall went up. Over the years , many of my friends were history buffs like I am, and quite a few had military backgrounds, and what we are concerned about is we have been seeing over the past decade and even more so of late, the infiltration of outside sources into American life. Take a pause , remember your High School or College history into conflict ( or military college or studies in the various service branches ) and the basic concept into winning a war...............divide and conquer. Noted above we often want to blame US companies , and yes they are complicit in certain ways, but we lost our moral and ethical compass when we silently listened to the facts that a President (even prior to his term ) telling countries to look into his foes by hacking internet sites.

We are at fault for not calling upon all parties when things like this continued , but even more so we are at fault for not screaming at the top of our lungs when recently we found out for over 9 months the Russians have hacked into our most sensitive and important services, defense fortification ( including nuclear ), etc. Divide and conquer, divide and conquer, there is no doubt in my mind while we are arguing or worried about may perceived problems we have been systematically battered by propaganda that is not from either a Democratic side or a Republican side. In fact , Facebook, Google, Twitter, etc. ( I am not defending them ) has told us so over and over , with the fake sites, individuals they have found and have shut down. Divide and conquer, divide and conquer, and how easy it is with an American Internet society that no longer questions , we believe the Internet Bible as being all true.

One has to question why we are so asleep at the wheel when young children in Finland are taught in school how to be aware of Russian propaganda -- in 3rd grade!! Those of us who grew up during the Cold War understood the fear and uncertainty, but since today we are not constantly seeing tanks, warheads or missiles being raised in Cuba or along the borders of our Allies , we have become neutered to who our real enemies are. Now, we also know China , Iran , and North Korea are doing the same thing , but are we fired up when we found out our most sensitive systems defending our Country have been breached, uh, no, we are arguing about trivial things between ourselves.

We should really have had a wake up call when we think about how pleased they are in Russia, China , North Korea and more , and after the simple breaching of the sacred Capital of the US, they have to even realize how easy it might be to breach US Government offices and place something destructive. We have opened up our Democracy to our enemies , showing we are not as powerful or as controlled a Country as we portray, and they are winning more and more silent battles --- divide and conquer.

I am tired of listening to derogatory, name calling, bullying of the past years because words do matter and I do believe more than the sensitive services and secret government installations have been compromised, I believe it is also the American Psyche. We have a Pandemic of historic proportions and we are arguing over silly things like wearing a mask, whereas 20-30 years ago we would have respected each other and just done it if it might protect our friends and relatives or even strangers. Stop and look in the mirror and realize how silly this is that we are even arguing about a piece of cloth to wear when around others, and yet we are spending time arguing about this, walls along a border ( which Californians die laughing about because the crime ridden drug lords just tunnel under ), and possible changes in our government ( we seldom stop and realize how little things actually change with the passing of a Republican or Democratic President ), and we failed to see the real threat coming from outside the USA. Divide and conquer..................time to wake up, time to start using polite and correct vocabulary , and stop making assumptions.

There are tons of Americans out there who are moderate Republicans, middle of the road Democrats or just plain Independents. Many of us have always voted for who we think will do the best job, that is our only criteria, but we have to look at ourselves , the media , the internet and ask why do we only have the Radical Left or the Right Wing Conservatives now, instead of Democrats and Republicans. I firmly believe the bulk of us are more likely one or the other and not Radical and not Right Wing , but words that inflame has been part of the modus operandi over the past 4 years. Time for more civility, time for more respect , time for more awareness, and definitely time for us to be aware of the threats from outside. The pot has been stirred to make us fight among ourselves and we are blind to what would have been an act of War just a short time back. Divide and conquer, no, time for us to awaken , realize how unbelievably horrible what happened on the 6th truly was, and how we have a beast within being fed from monsters without.

I am stunned and mad about no real reaction by our current President when we found the offices of the United States were breached by our main enemy and nothing really happened , that should have been the stimulus that stopped our little differences , because the threat from outside has likely never been greater. I gasped when I heard our Nuclear deterrent systems were one of the areas compromised ------- why are we blind, that I blame on a President who has spent more time on the golf course, has not been addressing the problems of the Pandemic and has been stirring the pot among Americans instead of confronting what could be the largest threat we have ever encountered in our Country. And, yes, I am disturbed both the Democrats and Republicans in our Government are spending so much time fighting they too are blind to such a gigantic threat to our Republic.

The 6th has embarrassed us as the World's Best Democracy , but more importantly it is also a wake up call that we have been infiltrated by so much phony propaganda , we are fighting among ourselves. We are so similar when we look in the mirror, we need to come together realizing how damaging an attack on our Capital really is, and we need to awaken to the War coming from outside our borders and not let them continue to win anymore battles.

This is a great place to come to, folks respect each other , help each other and look forward to the camaraderie both on the Forum and at the track. We recognize our similarities in racing Mustangs, modding the beasts ( cosmetic or mechanical ) and many of us reflect on how lucky we truly are compared to the bulk of the World. I love this Forum , and I respect the members because we take time to joke around in a friendly manner and we assist folks without telling anyone to go look for the " Search Button." None of us are on this Planet for long, and it is a pleasure to hang with friends, accept our differences and understand the enthusiasm so many of us get from an inanimate object ---- that is another concept we could talk about for days.

When I read your post I think you might like to read the 10 goals of the Communist Manefesto. IMO this is the war we are fighting.

 

TymeSlayer

Tramps like us, Baby we were born to run...
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What kills me is when people say that "America has gone to Hell" or "I'm ashamed of what America has become."
Fact of the matter is, the actions of a few does not constitute us as a whole. This is what the jackasses in the Fourth Estate is hoping to accomplish. Shock value under the guise of breaking news. BTW, why is it that the riots earlier this year in Portland, Denver and all the other cities got little to no play on CNN, CNBC and MSNBC? Not taking any sides here as I'm a lifelong independent voter, but Fox was the only one that covered all the riots.
Let's face it, the Fourth Estate only wants you to see what they want you to see. News is no longer news but rather than propaganda put forth to further one's agenda.

And don't anyone give me that crap that just because I avoid the biased media, I'm burying my head in the sand. I just have more important things to do than to become a lemming.
 
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Well in the interest of making sure that people aren't too inclined to believe false statements on the internet it should be noted that the chief medical examiner who examined George Floyd's

Floyd did not deserve to die in the streets but found himself as consequence of his own action. He pushed the buttons of law enforcement one too many times. Floyd had a criminal record with years in prison and the whole sad story. Our country ignited over a criminal not a saint. The media painted this man as a victim while all his life he acted as a predator praying on the public. Maybe if the media exposed him for who his record shows he is our Country would not have burned. NBC article wrote of Floyd “Quiet personality but a beautiful spirit". Our media take fact of criminal written record and trivalize only to editorialize reader's emotional response.

Do we have problems that need to be addressed? OK but the way we are solving them isn't a good path or we get CHOP, Portland, and January 6th.
 

Bill Pemberton

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Have read many of these items Bob, and I understand your concerns, yet I am a realist and I will continue to view that our Government ( Democrat, Republican and Independent ) and the American people are being prodded and pushed to believe so many things that don't actually happen. Not saying the propaganda is not also coming from within, it is the fact that we are oblivious and not acting concerning what is coming from outside that bothers me. I am also not naive to not think that much of it is being directed toward both sides to inflame and it is not even secret. We have all heard , on all media outlets , that Facebook, Twitter, etc. have entire groups of employees constantly monitoring and deleting hackers and phony accts. from Russia, China, Iran, etc. and that is my point. We have a boatload of folks on here from California and I know two friends who work in these areas and I am sure there are others here aware of the infiltration. Fox, NBC, CBS, ABC, etc. all announced the infiltration of Government and Municipal sites , yet , we did nothing and in fact it went to the wayside -------
instead many are consumed with imagined " Fears. " We do have to continue to listen to each other , but hopefully we can start to respect and listen to others and focus on reality. In discussing things with friends the one area we bring up is perceived problems as opposed to the reality of what has occurred. I write down things sometimes that are perceived and then ask myself if it is really a real issue or just " Fear."

"Fear " is the key proponent of propaganda and one has to digest what is reality and what is perceived and it is difficult for all humans. None of us are immune , but I do think it is something we have to think about. This means we go back decades where we questioned everything, whereas today instant messaging makes us all believe immediately.

Nuff said, I guess part of my concern is I am lucky to have many friends around the Globe and they are all surprised we are so asleep, and to a man/woman they all think we are so blind to the immense amount of Freedoms we enjoy here compared to their Countries.

Right now the focus is a bastion of our Democracy was broken into, vandalized , and secured by rioters, and we should all be horrified , because it is the main Institution Representing our Republic. Wake up call , and we need to study the causes, and that means listening and respecting others and yes, also viewing those outside the USA working to destroy the most powerful Democracy in the World.
 

TMSBOSS

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I am tired of listening to derogatory, name calling, bullying of the past years because words do matter and I do believe more than the sensitive services and secret government installations have been compromised, I believe it is also the American Psyche.
Agree.. We now tend to embrace change instantly while ignoring the past. The lessons learned that got us here are all but forgotten. We have few if any world partners. Canada and the UK come to mind. All others are either friendly competitors or adversarial competitors. Old lessons we need to relearn Quickly!!

Serving in the Military helped me become very proud of America and of our ways. Why? Not because of the "Indoctrination".... in spite of it. I traveled to some of the nicest places in the world and to some of the deepest shiznit holes. NONE of these places could hold a candle to the USA. Our northern brothers and sisters come the closest.

One moment that I will remember for the rest of my life happened in Kandahar AFG. One of my Afghan managers was speaking to a few of the locals. He had just received documentation of approval for immigration to Canada, the company I worked for was Canadian and they sponsored this man and his family. He was asked why the US, Canada and the UK were so different from Afghanistan. His answer was this. These places are lands governed by the rule of law. Each man must follow the rules set and agreed upon by the whole. You go about your business and others go about theirs. You don't have to obey the local war lord, the village chief or anyone else as long as you follow the rules set by the group. You have a say in the way these rules are written and enforced.

Over the last 30 years we have become polarized as a people. Racial prejudice has been replaced by political prejudice. Neither deserve a moment of our time outside the efforts it takes to eliminate them. NONE!!!! Is the internet the tool used in executing our way of life. Yep and it will continue to do so as long as we let the tool and the masters of this tool control the people.

I have not given up on America. I work in southern Mississippi and expected to see massive inequality when I came down here. Glad I was disappointed in that regard. There are still the few hard cord "retards" living that mind set. They are so few and far between and they do not deserve mentioning. We Have Progressed so far regarding race relations and equality that when I see the rhetoric used by the fear mongers today, I laugh. After all, how could a society which has made such a massive change is such a short time not feel good about the progress??? The answer?? We have forgotten where we cane from, who we are and how the system which brought us here works. I'll give you a hint, internet discussions and fear mongering is not the answer. Talk to your neighbor, explore your mutual differences and accept others. Also reject the fear mongering which does not match with your personal experiences and observations. In short, think for yourself.
 

Bill Pemberton

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Huh, we should not even be having a discussion about George Floyd, because humanity is all that is about. Who cares if he had a criminal record , who cares if he had some drugs in his system, a knee was held on his throat for over 8 minutes. Trying to justify this as right is a serious moral question, and noticed no listing of the fact the officer had numerous brutality complaints over the years in his police record.

Two of my good racing buddies are Police Officers and their conscience and concern was echoed in their comments to me and others, " Four officers and holding him down for 8 minutes makes all of us look terrible. " It is a scary job being a Police Officer today, and most are great individuals , but we can not as a civilized society accept extreme brutality. One of the guys , and I did not bring up the George Floyd situation, he brought it up as they felt it reflected on them, told those of us standing listening, how he could not imagine with 4 guys there why they could not zip tie his hands and feet and be done with that?

Frankly, General Colin Powell would not address the ravaging of the Capital as a Black or White situation , nor would he pause to compare , because all riots are wrong and he stated each severe issue should be viewed on it's own as a separate and singular problem. We are off subject , but hopefully we will all take time in the coming days to realize how awful this was, the lives put at risk and to ponder this;

What if the rioter with the Molotov cocktails and rifle had gotten into the Capital, what if numerous Republican and Democratic Senators and Congressmen , along with their staffs had been killed . What if the Capital had partially burned, this horrible breach of security needs to be answered , we need to come together and realize how lucky we were to only lose 5 lives and numerous injured ( and that in itself is horrible! )

The Reality is we were extremely lucky and I do not want to imagine the chaos that could have occurred trying to run our Country if many of our elected Representatives were dead or dying. Think about it .....................
 

Ludachris

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People fall for the Trump hate bandwagon promoted by the media. Trump has only championed improvement for better lives of Americans. This does not fit with the Globalist narrative of one world government. This is why the media has a meltdown when our US embassy moves to Jerusalem or Trump takes actions that put America 1st. Trump has done more than any president I can remember to protect the last check and balance against fast change to our lives by placing 3 originalist justices on the SCOTUS. This does not prevent change. It prevents radical change. This is his true lasting legacy. This is only a fraction of the positive he has done to make average American lives better. The guy isn't dating my daughter. I'm only interested in his results. Too many are wrapped up in emotion.

The left calls Trump an evil racist white supremacist yet Trump positively effected African Americans with the 1st step act and increased federal funding to predominatly African American colleges and universities. Here is Trump receiving the Ellis Island Award with Rosa Parks and Muhamad Ali!View attachment 60985
This is a common perspective Bob, and I've read plenty of popular counter perspectives to it as well. That isn't really the point here though, at least I don't think it was what prompted Rob to start the thread. To dismiss the way over half the nation feels about the president as them being misguided by MSM or gullible plays into what I said earlier about the way we insult each other when we disagree. People on both sides point to the other saying the same thing about manipulation. Once we get past the idea that our perspective is the most sound and/or sensible and/or justified, and stop grouping everyone who shares an opposing perspective into the same box (inferior), we'll be in a better place. I know I'm guilty of it too, but am trying to be less judgmental.

Propaganda and rhetoric are certainly very influential, we all know words matter and they do push people into action. You can tell by what is shared and regurgitated everywhere, especially from the most popular and polarizing figures/organizations on social media - which is where most people tend to get their current events updates these days (not sure I'd call it "news" - most of it is more entertainment than news). There are reports out there that can give more stats about where the average person gets their news these days, but I've read a few in recent years that found the majority use social media to find updates on everything now. MSM might still deliver the stories, but the real power is the headline of a social media update. MSM anchors have been replaced by social media influencers (politicians included) that give their own slant to everything happening in the world.

Ever notice how everyone is either outraged by: A) the events being covered in the story B) the way the story is being framed by one outlet or another for a particular slant or C) why other events aren't being reported instead? The source of the outrage isn't the news itself, it's the constant battle for eyeballs/attention from every organization and individual out there. Everyone wants you to share their outrage or help champion their cause. It's no wonder we've all written off most of the messaging and have become so cynical unless the message is relevant to us.
 

Grant 302

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That’s a pretty thin argument for venting your politics.

And the MSM generally feeds only 1 side, you can switch from CNN to MSNBC in the middle of a statement and they'll almost finish the sentence

The other side of MSM has its own network.
 

Bill Pemberton

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Ha, Ha, great copy of TMS's quote , LudaChris, and I echo your sentiment ----- I do tend to type like I talk, often way toooooo much.

Tracy --- perfect words, brief , but impactful in their simplicity at how we all should view our fellow Americans.
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
This is a great place to come to, folks respect each other , help each other and look forward to the camaraderie both on the Forum and at the track. We recognize our similarities in racing Mustangs, modding the beasts ( cosmetic or mechanical ) and many of us reflect on how lucky we truly are compared to the bulk of the World. I love this Forum , and I respect the members because we take time to joke around in a friendly manner and we assist folks without telling anyone to go look for the " Search Button." None of us are on this Planet for long, and it is a pleasure to hang with friends, accept our differences and understand the enthusiasm so many of us get from an inanimate object ---- that is another concept we could talk about for days.

I’d like to say this just once:

Bill, then stop advising people on who they should listen to or take advice from. Let them read what is posted and decide on their own.
 

Ludachris

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I’d like to say this just once:

Bill, then stop advising people on who they should listen to or take advice from. Let them read what is posted and decide on their own.
Is this in the context of this thread or more in general for this forum? If it's the latter, I'd say that Bill isn't the only one here who shares his opinion on which members are good authorities for different subjects, nor should he (or anyone) stop doing it. Some people on this forum who have a great deal of expertise share very little about themselves in their profiles, which makes it very difficult for the lurkers to qualify how much they know or should be trusted when reading their posts. Having others validate what they say helps with that - it's part of the process of helping people learn about a subject.
 

Grant 302

basic and well known psychic
Is this in the context of this thread or more in general for this forum? If it's the latter, I'd say that Bill isn't the only one here who shares his opinion on which members are good authorities for different subjects, nor should he (or anyone) stop doing it. Some people on this forum who have a great deal of expertise share very little about themselves in their profiles, which makes it very difficult for the lurkers to qualify how much they know or should be trusted when reading their posts. Having others validate what they say helps with that - it's part of the process of helping people learn about a subject.

What I quoted from Bill above is what makes this a good, functional forum.

Telling people who to listen to isn’t.

It’s not unlike people parroting info from their favorite network while bashing other networks...when they’re all MSM.
 
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If we go back to @blacksheep-1's original post on this thread, he's making an important point. He was appalled that an intelligent and highly trained person could end up dead because various forms of media had convinced them to go on a suicide mission.

There are very few forms of media that haven't learned how to make money by getting people riled up, and we're watching as the population around the world responds to that new onslaught. People who can manipulate and operate this wonderful new influence peddling machine - mainstream media, clickstream media and social media, as well as the "contributors" who earn a living off of likes and clicks - have gained outsized influence and many people haven't yet learned to control their responses to them. As we saw with the young lady in the Capitol, it's not some "fringe" that gets caught up in this storm, it's people that come across as pretty normal most of the time.
 
The news media as a whole made having conversations with my dad and brother difficult for a good long while (8+ years) as they were consumed by it. I personally don't watch news unless it's local and that isn't on a daily basis. I just found it amazing they literally took stories that were happening anywhere in the world and believed it meant that their way of life was in immenate danger.

Media on both sides is powerful, hopefully society can break their addiction on it soon. The world will be much better off.
 

Ludachris

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If we go back to @blacksheep-1's original post on this thread, he's making an important point. He was appalled that an intelligent and highly trained person could end up dead because various forms of media had convinced them to go on a suicide mission.
I think he is disturbed that the person is dead - as to the question of why, you might be drawing a different conclusion than him. Maybe not, I don't know for sure.
There are very few forms of media that haven't learned how to make money by getting people riled up, and we're watching as the population around the world responds to that new onslaught. People who can manipulate and operate this wonderful new influence peddling machine - mainstream media, clickstream media and social media, as well as the "contributors" who earn a living off of likes and clicks - have gained outsized influence and many people haven't yet learned to control their responses to them. As we saw with the young lady in the Capitol, it's not some "fringe" that gets caught up in this storm, it's people that come across as pretty normal most of the time.
I hear plenty of people I consider to be fairly level headed and intelligent make (or share) statements that seem to be a little extreme - on both sides of the partisan spectrum. Most of the time the words they use or the examples they reference are easily found to be trending with a quick search. I chalk it up to the idea that they must have experienced something notable in life to make them accept that information as being true, something I haven't experienced or maybe I just reacted to the experience differently due to my previous collective experiences.

As for the trend of news being shared to rile people up, that's been true for a long time. If news doesn't incite a reaction it isn't really news, and most news shared needs a reaction in order to measure whether the effort going into sharing that news was worth the time investment. It isn't always just about profit either, it's about "prophet" - vanity and narcissism drive a lot of it. And the barrier for entry to become an influencer has dropped considerably in recent years.
 
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